Q: Big4 - Yearly salary increment

Originally Posted by Unregistered

Lol

Now all the seniors all scare juniors jeopardise their careers

Really? what got to do with us juniors? You screw up your own career, don't blame us juniors.

Originally Posted by Unregistered

No one is asking associates to work until 4am like we seniors have to, we don't even ask you guys to follow up after your booking ended for your sections, but can you all at least work until 8pm or 9pm so that it's 10 hours like the resource planning stated while you're booked on the job? Especially since you'll be taking breaks and eating 2 hour meals so the 10 hours is actually <8 hours of productive work.

We have done the same work you did before so we know how long it takes for someone doing it for the first time. I've also seen those videos telling people to pretend that they don't understand so that the task "takes longer" but they're actually done so that they can chill.

Do you realise you are being very toxic but trying to disguise it as reasonable?

1) Work to 8pm is not normal. You are trying to normalise it or have accepted it because you got used to it. But as the senior you should not be forcing this as an expectation to us.

2) Ok sure you have done the same work, you have suffered, good for you. But everyone learn at their own pace so don’t expect us to work at same speed as you. You happy to work to 8pm, good for you. But don’t assume everyone is like you.

ISTG it’s because of people like you who spoil the market for so long that this is the prevailing expectation.

Don’t make your problem our problem. Don’t hard sell me on that “we are family” nonsense

Originally Posted by Unregistered

a normal human efficiency at most is around 80% max.
it is the big4 fault for pushing the 10 to 12hr into 8 hr job.

thats why everyone just gave up.
the more snr and mgr tank, the happier the partners.

tank more, less rewards.

Sometimes it goes up to 20 hours. That's why many leave when booked on those intensive engagements. They get paid the same, yet there's so much work.

Originally Posted by Unregistered

Do you realise you are being very toxic but trying to disguise it as reasonable?

1) Work to 8pm is not normal. You are trying to normalise it or have accepted it because you got used to it. But as the senior you should not be forcing this as an expectation to us.

2) Ok sure you have done the same work, you have suffered, good for you. But everyone learn at their own pace so don’t expect us to work at same speed as you. You happy to work to 8pm, good for you. But don’t assume everyone is like you.

ISTG it’s because of people like you who spoil the market for so long that this is the prevailing expectation.

Don’t make your problem our problem. Don’t hard sell me on that “we are family” nonsense

It's about accountability and being a team player. This is the nature of big four peak.

Else feel free to look elsewhere?

Not from audit btw

Originally Posted by Unregistered

Lol my bro-in-law also encountered this

What my bro-in-law is tell this Philippines talented person not to touch or do anything

He say what you need to do is help the whole team to make coffee

Just let this person sit there do nothing and make coffee when needed

Ask the person go help to buy lunch and dinner

Sorry different context, I meant the Philippines offshore ppl, not Philippines working in sg. These offshore ppl don’t even need a work permit

Originally Posted by Unregistered

Do you realise you are being very toxic but trying to disguise it as reasonable?

1) Work to 8pm is not normal. You are trying to normalise it or have accepted it because you got used to it. But as the senior you should not be forcing this as an expectation to us.

2) Ok sure you have done the same work, you have suffered, good for you. But everyone learn at their own pace so don’t expect us to work at same speed as you. You happy to work to 8pm, good for you. But don’t assume everyone is like you.

ISTG it’s because of people like you who spoil the market for so long that this is the prevailing expectation.

Don’t make your problem our problem. Don’t hard sell me on that “we are family” nonsense

+1. Totally agreed.
The contract states the working hours. I'm not obligated to over work that time.
Once in a while, OT 1 or 2 hr is fine. But not every day.
We have our own life, and we are not sacrificing it.
If they want to sacrifice, so be it. Dont drag us.

Originally Posted by Unregistered

covid is peak job market for fresh grads though... people are still getting lots of great IB and consulting offers even during covid period so you have to be really bad if all you're getting is offer for audit...

that said, i don't think you realize how bad the work ethics of some people are. i've seen people literally watching kdrama at work then kpkb when people complain about them. the worst is a girl who is perpetually on leave every time there's meetings so other people have to do her work for her...

anyway our OT is until 9pm only and that's max 3 days at a time. i'm happy to get japanese fruits, desserts, spare hampers, and expensive mooncakes and celebration meals in exchange for that. at least it shows that my boss knows OT after 6pm is bad instead of treating that as the norm. i've never heard of big 4 having a culture of thanking others for covering for them...

Of course we know slacking is bad but who cares? Deal with it.

Originally Posted by Unregistered

It's about accountability and being a team player. This is the nature of big four peak.

Else feel free to look elsewhere?

Not from audit btw

sorry. your team player nonsense dont appeal to gen z anymore.
yes it is about accountability, but how do u expect people to be accountable for a job that requires so much OT?

use. ur. brain. n think.

Originally Posted by Unregistered

If there's 20 hours of task

Person A only do 8 hours

Person B has to take on that extra 2 hours of work to complete = 10 + 2 + 12 hours

2 hours might not seem a lot but when compared like this, person B has to work 4 extra hours compared to person A

Sure, person A deserves WLB like any human being but I don't think person B is any less deserving of WLB than person A

The workload is not going to magically disappear just because person A doesn't want to do it either

So the best is everyone take their fair share and OT a little so that everyone can go home earlier

Obviously you can say hire more but how to hire extra people in 1 day?

The problem is already in front of you and needs to be solved immediately

It's like saying no need firefighter to waste water to quell fire on a boat because hard work lah, by right mother nature should be pouring rain anyway.

Like no **** but the boat is already burning right now, who can wait for the rain to slowly pour if god decides 'ok i agree and give you rain'?

You don't mind getting burned but others mind, maybe should've let other people who are happy to help quell the flames onto the boat in the first place since everyone knows the boat will be on fire based on track record and need lots of people to put out flames.

No one is asking associates to work until 4am like we seniors have to, we don't even ask you guys to follow up after your booking ended for your sections, but can you all at least work until 8pm or 9pm so that it's 10 hours like the resource planning stated while you're booked on the job? Especially since you'll be taking breaks and eating 2 hour meals so the 10 hours is actually <8 hours of productive work.

We have done the same work you did before so we know how long it takes for someone doing it for the first time. I've also seen those videos telling people to pretend that they don't understand so that the task "takes longer" but they're actually done so that they can chill.

u damn toxic.
why not person B also do 8hrs, and let the mgr cover?
then let the mgr go talk to partner lor.
toxic. this kind of thing still dare to say

Originally Posted by Unregistered

It's about accountability and being a team player. This is the nature of big four peak.

Else feel free to look elsewhere?

Not from audit btw

Contract states overtime is needed depending on deadlines so I dunno what that guy is going on about.

It's like junior lawyers refusing to rush to complete drafting before deadline so someone has to saikang for you. Freshies aren't changing firm policies with their little boycott especially since partners dont even know it's happening so for the time being just make way for someone who can help the team. Is this seriously so difficult for people to grasp?

Don't be a doctor if you aren't willing to be on-call, lots of people want that spot. I think audit OT culture is stupid too but it's a sinkie problem, not your teammates' problem.