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  #15501 (permalink)  
Old 19-01-2022, 12:34 PM
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Hi,

I am a trainee at a small firm and am wondering what is the current market pay for associates in a small firm around CBD area?

Also whether the bigger firms are a good place to start out as a fresh graduate or would staying in a small firm be a better place? (The small firm has good work life balance but I am afraid I might get very low pay hence finding out the market rate) Thanks!!
It depends on the firm, some firms pay market rate, some pay far less. The size of the firm matters alot less than the type of work you do (if you are practicing family/crim law, or general "I do everything" law, that's usually lower pay).

However, you can usually tell how much you'll be getting by how much you're getting for tc. Are you getting the standard 2k-2.5k? If not, you're unlikely to get market rate pay.

If your firm is cheap enough to want to save like 200-800 off market rate (i.e. paying you 1.2k to 1.8k for TC), they are unlikely to bump you to market rate afterwards.

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  #15502 (permalink)  
Old 19-01-2022, 01:29 PM
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Hi,

I am a trainee at a small firm and am wondering what is the current market pay for associates in a small firm around CBD area?

Also whether the bigger firms are a good place to start out as a fresh graduate or would staying in a small firm be a better place? (The small firm has good work life balance but I am afraid I might get very low pay hence finding out the market rate) Thanks!!
Don't accept any NQ offer that is less than $4.8k pls. With the shortage of junior lawyers, there's no reason to accept quasi-slavery.

To answer your second question, the rule of thumb is that all bigger firms are better places to start your career than small firms, with the exception of working for a market leader like Davi's firm or Michael Hwang chambers for liti or Helmsman for shipping, for e.g. But if you were in such a firm, you wouldn't be asking this question.

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  #15503 (permalink)  
Old 19-01-2022, 02:16 PM
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Don't accept any NQ offer that is less than $4.8k pls. With the shortage of junior lawyers, there's no reason to accept quasi-slavery.

To answer your second question, the rule of thumb is that all bigger firms are better places to start your career than small firms, with the exception of working for a market leader like Davi's firm or Michael Hwang chambers for liti or Helmsman for shipping, for e.g. But if you were in such a firm, you wouldn't be asking this question.
The exploitation has got to stop. Please stop accepting unpaid TCs

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  #15504 (permalink)  
Old 19-01-2022, 03:39 PM
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The favourite refrain of some partners is.. "I already did my time last time, now it's your turn", like some macabre and perverse "I suffered so you suffer now" game.

Also, most partners had it much easier as assocs than now due to the alleged "glut" a few years ago (and their pay was "higher" as opposed to a stagnated wage now).
This is the same sort of fallacious argument that the current boomer generation used to justify NS, that they wasted two years of their lives before and hence their children have to. Ironically its thereby better to be born a foreigner and migrate to Singapore to work than to be born a male here, given that foreigners here pay the same income tax and enjoy living in the same safe environment but do not need to waste two years of their most productive life earning peanuts.

Wasn't it some threads back that a TC trainee astutely pointed out NQ pay had stagnated for the last 10 years while HDB prices has increased from $300-400k to a millions dollars?

How come our lawyers remuneration are not benchmarked to inflation? Our political leaders pay are benchmarked and so should ours.
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  #15505 (permalink)  
Old 19-01-2022, 03:49 PM
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Lightbulb TMT (Tech, Media, Telco) query

Need genuine advice here - no trolls please

1. What is the legal landscape for TMT (Tech, Media, Telco) in Singapore? Is it up and coming? Lawyers typically are not tech-inclined so I am unsure if the legal industry can really support the TMT landscape which is evolving rapidly. The legal industry is relative traditional and structurally inflexible.

2. Which firm and/or partners are good (not those psycho ones please)? How about Lim Chong Kin (from Drew), Gloria Goh (A&G)?

Thanks
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  #15506 (permalink)  
Old 19-01-2022, 04:03 PM
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Need genuine advice here - no trolls please

1. What is the legal landscape for TMT (Tech, Media, Telco) in Singapore? Is it up and coming? Lawyers typically are not tech-inclined so I am unsure if the legal industry can really support the TMT landscape which is evolving rapidly. The legal industry is relative traditional and structurally inflexible.

2. Which firm and/or partners are good (not those psycho ones please)? How about Lim Chong Kin (from Drew), Gloria Goh (A&G)?

Thanks
TMT is "up and coming" in the sense that it's still a relatively new field in SG, with room for growth. It's not going to be a major sector on its own in SG, unless you count it alongside IP-work.

You'll have better luck if you focus on gen IP instead.

In terms of the firms/partners, given that good IP and TMT work requires big clients, you can't really go wrong with any b4 IP tier 1.
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  #15507 (permalink)  
Old 19-01-2022, 05:40 PM
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Need genuine advice here - no trolls please

1. What is the legal landscape for TMT (Tech, Media, Telco) in Singapore? Is it up and coming? Lawyers typically are not tech-inclined so I am unsure if the legal industry can really support the TMT landscape which is evolving rapidly. The legal industry is relative traditional and structurally inflexible.

2. Which firm and/or partners are good (not those psycho ones please)? How about Lim Chong Kin (from Drew), Gloria Goh (A&G)?

Thanks
You're conflating a few issues under (1).

When lawyers use TMT, they mean it as a practice area. Basically lawyers servicing clients in the tech and telecomms industry. Strong firms in this area are R&T, Bird & Bird, Osborne Clark etc. Adjacent advisory areas to this are data protection and privacy, cybersecurity, fintech regulatory issues, to name a few. I suppose you already know this since you mentioned Chong Kin in (2).

The more general point is that tech background is generally not needed in this practice area because these are essentially corporate/transactional or regulatory lawyers advising tech and telecomms clients on legal needs. The sector has always been there and will always need legal advice. As long as SingTel Starhub or M1 needs lawyers (the most traditional kind of "TMT" client you can ever get).

If by lawyers being "not tech-inclined" and "traditional and structurally inflexible" relative to a landscape that's "evolving rapidly", you mean the advent of Legaltech, well that's really another conversation entirely.
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  #15508 (permalink)  
Old 20-01-2022, 06:09 AM
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Need genuine advice here - no trolls please

1. What is the legal landscape for TMT (Tech, Media, Telco) in Singapore? Is it up and coming? Lawyers typically are not tech-inclined so I am unsure if the legal industry can really support the TMT landscape which is evolving rapidly. The legal industry is relative traditional and structurally inflexible.

2. Which firm and/or partners are good (not those psycho ones please)? How about Lim Chong Kin (from Drew), Gloria Goh (A&G)?

Thanks
Why do I get the sense that youíre a troll?
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  #15509 (permalink)  
Old 20-01-2022, 08:57 AM
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Fervent Chambers just posted an ad on Lawsocietycareers saying they are offering first yearers $6.5k. Anyone can verify whether itís true?
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  #15510 (permalink)  
Old 20-01-2022, 09:12 AM
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Fervent Chambers just posted an ad on Lawsocietycareers saying they are offering first yearers $6.5k. Anyone can verify whether itís true?
Their roster of lawyers has been frequently changing. And I thought they wanted to be listed on some legal directories within the first year of incorporation?
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