Fresh Grad from local U cant find job, any advice?

Originally Posted by Unregistered

Then your conversation and focus should be directed towards how we can get the government to release the figures, and why it is important, rather than jumping the step and throwing statements/conclusions, no matter how anecdotal they might be. On a similar note, they just released certain numbers with regards to PR statuses, which people have always been asking for. Not as comprehensive as we would like it to be for sure, but it's a start to a decent conversation.

Blaming CECA, blaming PRs, blaming LGBTS, blaming God, blaming the rich, blaming the government without statistics, blaming anyone, certainly doesn't help whatever cause you are fighting for. Go figure.

But you were the one that stated "you need to show links/statistics/empirical evidence" in the first place. How can we show links/statistics/empirical evidence if its virtually impossible to begin with in.

Unless you didn't know that these links/statistics/empirical evidence were unattainable in the first place. But hey, at least now you know.

Also, "blaming the government without statistics", the government is the one that releases the statistics, if they don't give us any, shouldn't they be blamed? You're going in circles. Go figure

Originally Posted by Unregistered

But you were the one that stated "you need to show links/statistics/empirical evidence" in the first place. How can we show links/statistics/empirical evidence if its virtually impossible to begin with in.

Unless you didn't know that these links/statistics/empirical evidence were unattainable in the first place. But hey, at least now you know.

Also, "blaming the government without statistics", the government is the one that releases the statistics, if they don't give us any, shouldn't they be blamed? You're going in circles. Go figure

Lol u are right. He is really going around in circles. No single private entity has this information other than the govt. The govt knows best of such data. Them refusing to release it thoroughly speaks volume of the damage it can cause to our country.

If he wants to continue dismissing anecdotal cases where anecdotal cases are the next best alternative to the lack of official data, then he has no grounds to argue anything against the validity of anecdotal cases.

In fact it should be his onus to come up with the official data to dismiss anecdotal claims for anyone can claim anything and he doesnt have anything to prove otherwise.

Originally Posted by Unregistered

But you were the one that stated "you need to show links/statistics/empirical evidence" in the first place. How can we show links/statistics/empirical evidence if its virtually impossible to begin with in.

Unless you didn't know that these links/statistics/empirical evidence were unattainable in the first place. But hey, at least now you know.

Also, "blaming the government without statistics", the government is the one that releases the statistics, if they don't give us any, shouldn't they be blamed? You're going in circles. Go figure

1. Unless you didn't know that these links/statistics/empirical evidence were unattainable in the first place. But hey, at least now you know <-- Unattainable now yes. In the future? That depends how far we can go on this conversation by voting in more opposition and applying political pressure. Hence the conversation.

2. Also, "blaming the government without statistics", the government is the one that releases the statistics, if they don't give us any, shouldn't they be blamed? You're going in circles. <-- This is a typical case of someone who completely doesn't understand the grasp of the sentence.
"Blaming the government for CECA" (which was the context of my sentence) does not equate to "blaming the government for not releasing the statistic on CECA". You are questioning CECA/the government for CECA. I am asking you to question the government on not releasing statistics for CECA. I'm not going around in circles. You just don't understand the problem you want to solve.

In fact I am surprised why you are so willing to challenge the government on CECA, but so willing to accept your fate can't get statistics from the government. Both are influenced by the government.

Shows your prejudice on the issue of Singapore employment.

Originally Posted by Unregistered

1. Unless you didn't know that these links/statistics/empirical evidence were unattainable in the first place. But hey, at least now you know <-- Unattainable now yes. In the future? That depends how far we can go on this conversation by voting in more opposition and applying political pressure. Hence the conversation.

2. Also, "blaming the government without statistics", the government is the one that releases the statistics, if they don't give us any, shouldn't they be blamed? You're going in circles. <-- This is a typical case of someone who completely doesn't understand the grasp of the sentence.
"Blaming the government for CECA" (which was the context of my sentence) does not equate to "blaming the government for not releasing the statistic on CECA". You are questioning CECA/the government for CECA. I am asking you to question the government on not releasing statistics for CECA. I'm not going around in circles. You just don't understand the problem you want to solve.

In fact I am surprised why you are so willing to challenge the government on CECA, but so willing to accept your fate can't get statistics from the government. Both are influenced by the government.

Shows your prejudice on the issue of Singapore employment.

1. I do applaud your optimism for believing that the existing government will be willing to share more data just because there is more opposition. I guess we will be going around in circles till the cows come home.

2. Maybe you don't understand the statement that you raised yourself. You asked for more evidence, but that's almost unattainable. You acknowledge that yourself. So anecdotal evidence is the next best evidence which the people here, and outside, choose to believe, but you were quick to ask for more evidence. It's fine if you choose to not believe what others have shared, but asking them to provide evidence which is likely unattainable sounds stupid to me.

"willing to accept your fate can't get statistics from the government" you've got to be kidding right. As mentioned in the previous reply, do you really think the government will give whatever the opposition and the citizens want? Or do you think they will strategically release whatever data they want and try to paint it in a positive light to advance their political agenda.

And this CECA issues has been ongoing for over a year. Maybe you forgot that a certain minister said "what is the point behind the question?" when asked about the ratio of PMETs by a certain opposition minister. And just a few days back, we got statistics which, in your own words "Not as comprehensive as we would like it to be for sure", after a year.

Originally Posted by Unregistered

1. I do applaud your optimism for believing that the existing government will be willing to share more data just because there is more opposition. I guess we will be going around in circles till the cows come home.

2. Maybe you don't understand the statement that you raised yourself. You asked for more evidence, but that's almost unattainable. You acknowledge that yourself. So anecdotal evidence is the next best evidence which the people here, and outside, choose to believe, but you were quick to ask for more evidence. It's fine if you choose to not believe what others have shared, but asking them to provide evidence which is likely unattainable sounds stupid to me.

"willing to accept your fate can't get statistics from the government" you've got to be kidding right. As mentioned in the previous reply, do you really think the government will give whatever the opposition and the citizens want? Or do you think they will strategically release whatever data they want and try to paint it in a positive light to advance their political agenda.

And this CECA issues has been ongoing for over a year. Maybe you forgot that a certain minister said "what is the point behind the question?" when asked about the ratio of PMETs by a certain opposition minister. And just a few days back, we got statistics which, in your own words "Not as comprehensive as we would like it to be for sure", after a year.

So what are you going to do about CECA or the government not releasing information? You can't even convince them to release statistics, what more to convince them to reassess our employment policies, including CECA? You can't change policies without changing the government mindset/changing the government.

The PR issue has probably been going more than a year, and we recently only made headwinds on it. I will not discount the possibility of the same for CECA straightaway. But just because the information is insufficient doesn't mean we can't get more. It shows the government is slowly relenting. Again, I'm surprised you are accepting the status quo of being information-deprived.

Go change the government mindset or government on statistics and having conversations. Else you'll always be stuck with your "CECAs" and you'll just be complaining about the policies without knowing what the real problem is: the government and/or the mindset.

Originally Posted by Unregistered

So what are you going to do about CECA or the government not releasing information? You can't even convince them to release statistics, what more to convince them to reassess our employment policies, including CECA? You can't change policies without changing the government mindset/changing the government.

The PR issue has probably been going more than a year, and we recently only made headwinds on it. I will not discount the possibility of the same for CECA straightaway. But just because the information is insufficient doesn't mean we can't get more. It shows the government is slowly relenting. Again, I'm surprised you are accepting the status quo of being information-deprived.

Go change the government mindset or government on statistics and having conversations. Else you'll always be stuck with your "CECAs" and you'll just be complaining about the policies without knowing what the real problem is: the government and/or the mindset.

I really applaud your optimism on that the government is willing to give in, and change their mindset, just to appease the demands and needs of citizens, and opposition.

Let's just say if the government made a mistake, do you think they will come out and apologize to us?

If your answer is yes, then I think you should be the one to open your eyes and change your mindset.

Originally Posted by Unregistered

So what are you going to do about CECA or the government not releasing information? You can't even convince them to release statistics, what more to convince them to reassess our employment policies, including CECA? You can't change policies without changing the government mindset/changing the government.

The PR issue has probably been going more than a year, and we recently only made headwinds on it. I will not discount the possibility of the same for CECA straightaway. But just because the information is insufficient doesn't mean we can't get more. It shows the government is slowly relenting. Again, I'm surprised you are accepting the status quo of being information-deprived.

Go change the government mindset or government on statistics and having conversations. Else you'll always be stuck with your "CECAs" and you'll just be complaining about the policies without knowing what the real problem is: the government and/or the mindset.

Also, you were the one who first brought up, "where is the evidence" when someone replied with their anecdotal incident(s). Then you went one round to try and tell me to change the mindset of the government or the government because the evidence is barely attainable, unbeknownst to you.

In that case, your reply shouldn't have been, "where is the evidence".

Originally Posted by Unregistered

I really applaud your optimism on that the government is willing to give in, and change their mindset, just to appease the demands and needs of citizens, and opposition.

Let's just say if the government made a mistake, do you think they will come out and apologize to us?

If your answer is yes, then I think you should be the one to open your eyes and change your mindset.

Since you're using a sweeping statement that government has never apologized, I'll use a sweeping example for the government apologizing for a mistake.

s://.channelnewsasia.com/news/singapore/mom-apologises-jade-rasif-inaccurate-account-maid-covid-19-14865092

I just used a totally irrelevant example as evidence, but evidence noetheless. Now you know how ridiculous it sounds when you use sweeping statements.

My mindset is that I want to either change the government approach on conversations, (or in extreme cases, change the government). Your mindset is to blame CECA without even taking the hard, but albeit correct way to convince the other side to have conversations and analyze the numbers. Is the root of your problem CECA, or the government? Go ask yourself that question. If it's just CECA, don't complain when the PR numbers go up, military service becomes 5 years, or when a foreigner coming from non-CECA countries come take your job.

Originally Posted by Unregistered

Since you're using a sweeping statement that government has never apologized, I'll use a sweeping example for the government apologizing for a mistake.

s://.channelnewsasia.com/news/singapore/mom-apologises-jade-rasif-inaccurate-account-maid-covid-19-14865092

I just used a totally irrelevant example as evidence, but evidence noetheless. Now you know how ridiculous it sounds when you use sweeping statements.

My mindset is that I want to either change the government approach on conversations, (or in extreme cases, change the government). Your mindset is to blame CECA without even taking the hard, but albeit correct way to convince the other side to have conversations and analyze the numbers. Is the root of your problem CECA, or the government? Go ask yourself that question. If it's just CECA, don't complain when the PR numbers go up, military service becomes 5 years, or when a foreigner coming from non-CECA countries come take your job.

Yea apologizing after many days of back and forth conversations, a half hearted initial 'apology', and merely required a well known influencer, to get an apology. If that is your standard for an apology, then ill be damned.

And again, what numbers? Those barely attainable numbers that scratch any surface which took over a year to be released?

Also, my mindset isn't to immediately put down incidents raised by others by asking them for evidence/numbers, knowing damn well those numbers are not attainable today, which is actually your mindset.

So one can only blame CECA and not the government as well? Wasn't CECA an agreement carried out by the GOVERNEMENT.

Originally Posted by Unregistered

Yea apologizing after many days of back and forth conversations, a half hearted initial 'apology', and merely required a well known influencer, to get an apology. If that is your standard for an apology, then ill be damned.

And again, what numbers? Those barely attainable numbers that scratch any surface which took over a year to be released?

Also, my mindset isn't to immediately put down incidents raised by others by asking them for evidence/numbers, knowing damn well those numbers are not attainable today, which is actually your mindset.

So one can only blame CECA and not the government as well? Wasn't CECA an agreement carried out by the GOVERNEMENT.

Whatever you type, he will have a counterpoint to it. So we should just ignore him.