pay for gov/public sector vs mnc vs sme

Originally Posted by Unregistered

Hi don't mind me asking, but what are you looking for when you start this post?

Because after reading the whole post so far, it seems when people provide research & analysis, you not interested. When some people disagree in discussion, you tell others not to turn your thread into flame war. When people give general answers, you tell others not to generalise. So to me is like say whatever answer also cannot please you........

At the end of the day, TS seem to still prefer sme ....

Originally Posted by bladez87

Deals.com.sg also SME.
Yeos also started as SME.

Most set ups start off as SME. Which is why I believe it depends on the industry and SME. We should not generalize SME as 1 category, there will always be the good and bad.

They might be big brand local names... but you honestly think they pay well for rank and file? Coy doing well does not equal employees get good/high pay. Sad but its true...

Originally Posted by Unregistered

what do you mean by farmers? who are they?
other terms used?

Generally in CS, if you are not a scholar, you are a farmer. Does not matter how high an MX u become/are... farmer = non AO.

Originally Posted by Unregistered

how much do MX8 and MX7 make?

Above 10K and below 18K if I remember correctly. MX8 onwards are rarer creatures in the CS lol

[cbee]

Originally Posted by Unregistered

Nice try to switch the topic. I have emphasized I think numerous times to TS (I am sure he will be glad to affirm) that chances of reaching senior levels are low and such numbers are not relfective of typical experience. My main point is to rebut your erronous assertion that MOM pay trends are reflective of only "respectable companies" and crazy stuff like 15k is the 75 percentile of a COO.

You have totally not followed up with these claims you callously put up earlier at all & instead went on to harp about "consistency" in gov service. Excuse me, we get it, gov job has better job secrutiy & fixed promotion path etc. We all know that & I doubt that is news to any layman on the street.

This lengthy write up is in response to your call earlier to back my claims up with solid data, which I have done so by providing a link to an archive of public remuneration discolusre and a sample of a Robert Walters report. Instead of either conceeding the point because of the overwhelming evidence or gathering rebutting facts & data, you choose to laugh it off by making a snide remark like "Lol. You must be very free to write such long essay." That line about sums up everything about you.

I am in the compensation consulting industry and the facts that this guy bring to the table is more accurate with my experiences. 15k monthly base is really just a senior managerial role. If 15k is the pay of any one deserving of a COO title, which we can all pretty much agree that he is probably within the top 5 highest paid in any company, he is severely underpaid, let alone 75th percentile. But I do have to point out that salary information from recruitment firms are usually slightly inflated and the manner of them gathering the data is quite dubious. But I guess it's good for just a rough idea. It would be more accurate to get compensation data from firms who specialize in such market data such as Mercer or Hay Group.

Relevant to the topic at hand though, I think a lot of people here sum up my views in pretty much the same manner. ultimately you gotta know what is your personality and how you can fit into the working culture and what you ultimately want to get from a career.

if you're a farmer, i believe CS is really just a pretty stable job. Got quite a lot of WLB one right I heard? One week working hours maybe less than 50?

if you're a scholar and you're in CS, then I guess you're bound to be earning loads.

if you're in a SME, i think it's really debatable. Some SMEs seriously cannot make it, some still alright. Probably depends on industry, your jobscope, and how you make the best out of it to launch you somewhere else.

if you're in a MNC, the pay ceiling is definitely the highest and opportunities are definitely the most bountiful assuming you have the drive and ambition to succeed.

do you consider a local listed company with interests in regional markets a MNC?

or when people say MNC, its mainly the US, German firms?

Originally Posted by Unregistered

do you consider a local listed company with interests in regional markets a MNC?

or when people say MNC, its mainly the US, German firms?

So is the following company consider MNC?

ST engineering
Keppel Corp

[cslee]

Originally Posted by cbee

I am in the compensation consulting industry and the facts that this guy bring to the table is more accurate with my experiences. 15k monthly base is really just a senior managerial role. If 15k is the pay of any one deserving of a COO title, which we can all pretty much agree that he is probably within the top 5 highest paid in any company, he is severely underpaid, let alone 75th percentile. But I do have to point out that salary information from recruitment firms are usually slightly inflated and the manner of them gathering the data is quite dubious. But I guess it's good for just a rough idea. It would be more accurate to get compensation data from firms who specialize in such market data such as Mercer or Hay Group.

Relevant to the topic at hand though, I think a lot of people here sum up my views in pretty much the same manner. ultimately you gotta know what is your personality and how you can fit into the working culture and what you ultimately want to get from a career.

if you're a farmer, i believe CS is really just a pretty stable job. Got quite a lot of WLB one right I heard? One week working hours maybe less than 50?

if you're a scholar and you're in CS, then I guess you're bound to be earning loads.

if you're in a SME, i think it's really debatable. Some SMEs seriously cannot make it, some still alright. Probably depends on industry, your jobscope, and how you make the best out of it to launch you somewhere else.

if you're in a MNC, the pay ceiling is definitely the highest and opportunities are definitely the most bountiful assuming you have the drive and ambition to succeed.

At last, someone is talking some sense, not like the other guy who totally missed my points in making swiping statements against a respectable sector in totally out of context manner. Government service is definitely not the highest paying sector but it's the most predictable career path (consistency here) i.e. you should be able to feed you and your family comfortably well and spend quality time with them. If you do work *consistently* smart/well and maintain good working relationships with your peers and bosses, I see very high chance (another consistency) of least retiring at MX9 and above. Just that most of the young officers don't last that long (including scholars - yes, many won't stay long either). I've with the service for quite sometime. Many had joined same time with me, but my batch only left with very few (sometime you can't help but can feel quite lonely at just beginning of mid-way).

Increments may be slow at beginning but can get quite rewarding in longer time span i.e. law of compound interests of 4-8% p.a. for average joe with occasional promotions of 8-15% (another consistency).

Having said that, you still won't be as rich as the top private bankers, top managers, top accountants etc unless you are absorbed into AO (very rare but still possible).

On the other hand, private sector is more rewarding and at same time chances of getting nowhere is also real e.g. US MNC is known to hire generously and fire quickly. Personally, I knew quite a few business acquaintances were hired into VP roles at young age in some IT US MNC but were at gone after 1-3 years (heard of being "fired" or "retrenched"). I also noted someone in thread mentioned that being unpredictable is fun. But I also do believe many still prefer stability (another "consistency" in career).

Originally Posted by Unregistered

Generally in CS, if you are not a scholar, you are a farmer. Does not matter how high an MX u become/are... farmer = non AO.

who are considered scholar? is there some special scholarship or any scholarship during bachelor/master/phd?

erm... I think cbee is agreeing with the guy who humtum you upside down leh. How come you saying he agree with you?

Originally Posted by cslee

At last, someone is talking some sense, not like the other guy who totally missed my points in making swiping statements against a respectable sector in totally out of context manner. Government service is definitely not the highest paying sector but it's the most predictable career path (consistency here) i.e. you should be able to feed you and your family comfortably well and spend quality time with them. If you do work *consistently* smart/well and maintain good working relationships with your peers and bosses, I see very high chance (another consistency) of least retiring at MX9 and above. Just that most of the young officers don't last that long (including scholars - yes, many won't stay long either). I've with the service for quite sometime. Many had joined same time with me, but my batch only left with very few (sometime you can't help but can feel quite lonely at just beginning of mid-way).

Increments may be slow at beginning but can get quite rewarding in longer time span i.e. law of compound interests of 4-8% p.a. for average joe with occasional promotions of 8-15% (another consistency).

Having said that, you still won't be as rich as the top private bankers, top managers, top accountants etc unless you are absorbed into AO (very rare but still possible).

On the other hand, private sector is more rewarding and at same time chances of getting nowhere is also real e.g. US MNC is known to hire generously and fire quickly. Personally, I knew quite a few business acquaintances were hired into VP roles at young age in some IT US MNC but were at gone after 1-3 years (heard of being "fired" or "retrenched"). I also noted someone in thread mentioned that being unpredictable is fun. But I also do believe many still prefer stability (another "consistency" in career).

Originally Posted by Unregistered

In my company (US MNC), engineers and sales guys are paid between 100K to 200K.
Directors are paid 200K to 300K. Senior execs inc. senior director, VP and SVP are paid 400K onwards. Almost everyone around me are on 6-figures package.

My first job was in a stat board. Had miserable increment and decided to join private. Started with a local SME and then a MNC. 8 years on, pay is 5 to 7 times the pay in stat board.

I am curious, this is my 8th years in 2nd giant size MNC, after 2 promotion , my annual package have not hit 100k yet, btw i am in engineering ..consumer electronic..

spend 5 years in a 100,000++ MNC, annual pay increment is pathetic.. only after i jump to competitor the pay seem pick up..

btw my KPI not bad, before i left i got a K some more..

Originally Posted by Unregistered

In my company (US MNC), engineers and sales guys are paid between 100K to 200K.
Directors are paid 200K to 300K. Senior execs inc. senior director, VP and SVP are paid 400K onwards. Almost everyone around me are on 6-figures package.

My first job was in a stat board. Had miserable increment and decided to join private. Started with a local SME and then a MNC. 8 years on, pay is 5 to 7 times the pay in stat board.

What is the proportion of these 100k+ guys compared to the size of the local office? Are they people promoted internally or external hires?