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  #14341 (permalink)  
Old 22-10-2021, 08:32 PM
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Does anyone not think the NOC drama hits home so hard? Reading the anecdotes from the NOC staffs is like reading a snapshot of my life

Break the cycle
I think you are comparing apples and pears here. People sign up to join NOC thinking that life as influencers will be fun, not knowing that working hours can be that long. Most of us went into the legal industry knowing what we are signing up for... so we reap what we sow - sort of. Nonetheless, any forms of corporate bullying, toxic bosses, and/or harassment should not be tolerated.

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  #14342 (permalink)  
Old 22-10-2021, 09:17 PM
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When I started out in practice at *** Law, I had a colleague one year my junior. She had it bad from the partner that we both worked for. The partner wasn't a very pleasant person to begin with. But I had (and I like to think I still do have) great tolerance for all kinds of personalities. NS and signing on for a bit (for some of the money for my LLB) taught me a lot about dealing with difficult people.

But back to my colleague. She swore that one day, when she ran her own practice, she would be different. She would be kinder. She wouldn't swear at all. She wouldn't call people at 10pm, or ask them to do things over the weekend.

Eventually (and naturally), she left *** Law. I left not long after, and went in-house.

After some time, I had the opportunity to instruct her on some litigation matters for the company I worked for at the time. We had a great time catching up and swapping stories.

And I watched how she ran her firm. It was a small office in Tanjong Pagar - small enough to throw a full ring binder from door to window.

It was like the partner from *** Law had come back to life (he had passed away some years ago by that time), albeit in female form. Right down to the tone of voice and the choice of profanities. I had not heard such words since I was an associate at *** Law.

My point is that you and others that hold such noble ideals can pontificate at length on how things have to change, blah blah blah.

You won't understand until you become the business owners yourselves. I'm not saying that such behaviour is right, or justifiable in any way. But it's easy enough to say that such behaviour is wrong, and that the next generation has to change, etc.

Very, very few people out there are fundamentally good/nice people. And it's sad/ironic that in my (limited) experience, the ones who bitch about it the most are, in turn, the most likely to dish it out.

We all want to work for nice/humane people. We don't seem to extend this expectation to ourselves, and we thus fail to realise that hardly anyone out there, ourselves included, is nice/humane.
Seem to be driving a point but actually just ranting with no purpose. Not to mention the extremely anecdotal point youíre trying to make. You and your friend from *** Law ages ago lmao.

I think thereís a difference, albeit small, between being abusive (emotionally and physically) vs being pressurised under extremely tight timelines.

To counter your anecdotal testimony with my own, I am from a b4 and although when there are tight timelines, people do get stressed and raises their voices, no one actually spews derogatory or degrading comments and insults. Everything was professional.

I think gradually, juniors and mid level lawyers will begin to appreciate the changing times. Itís the wage slave mentality that seems to be more worrisome; so that ppl are ok with oppression and the stark disparity between what employers hold in power and the employees.

Pray to the audience of this forum who are in the industry to evaluate the structure objectively, and if you still subscribe to the mentality where you are at mercy of the employer simply because they are your pay master then more power to you.

Otherwise, be the change you want to see

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  #14343 (permalink)  
Old 23-10-2021, 12:59 AM
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I think thereís a difference, albeit small, between being abusive (emotionally and physically) vs being pressurised under extremely tight timelines.

To counter your anecdotal testimony with my own, I am from a b4 and although when there are tight timelines, people do get stressed and raises their voices, no one actually spews derogatory or degrading comments and insults. Everything was professional.

I think gradually, juniors and mid level lawyers will begin to appreciate the changing times. Itís the wage slave mentality that seems to be more worrisome; so that ppl are ok with oppression and the stark disparity between what employers hold in power and the employees.

Pray to the audience of this forum who are in the industry to evaluate the structure objectively, and if you still subscribe to the mentality where you are at mercy of the employer simply because they are your pay master then more power to you.

Otherwise, be the change you want to see
agree that people need to be the change instead of expecting that others will care. but to do that people need to first stay in practice. so, imho, boys and girls, we're all different, no point destroying your soul and body for a couple of bucks in the early years just to burn out before you can even start making change (SA/partnership). but from what I see, junior partnership sometimes brings out the nastier side of people. is it necessary? difficult targets? i don't know, not at that stage yet.

Also, for those reading, hope you don't get the impression that we're all just a bunch of high-strung intense types. They don't speak for the rest! lol.

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  #14344 (permalink)  
Old 23-10-2021, 01:20 PM
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You'll know once you make partner
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  #14345 (permalink)  
Old 23-10-2021, 02:37 PM
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You'll know once you make partner
Why would I want to be.

My life is much better with less responsibility and continue bitching n sniping at partners and partners wannabes and still earn salary. End of the day I hold the firm to ransom and they will still promote me as a matter of time because of my senority.

Stupid. You just don't know how to play the game need limbu to teach you.
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  #14346 (permalink)  
Old 23-10-2021, 03:17 PM
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Why would I want to be.

My life is much better with less responsibility and continue bitching n sniping at partners and partners wannabes and still earn salary. End of the day I hold the firm to ransom and they will still promote me as a matter of time because of my senority.

Stupid. You just don't know how to play the game need limbu to teach you.
But working for people is still working for people. You might *think* you hold the partners to ransom but is that really so? Employees tend to think they are more important than they really are. Until they are sacked.
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  #14347 (permalink)  
Old 23-10-2021, 03:19 PM
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But working for people is still working for people. You might *think* you hold the partners to ransom but is that really so? Employees tend to think they are more important than they really are. Until they are sacked.
Please la. Why they sack me when there are any others who are similar or worse. I am protected. Its called race to the bottom but don't be the bottom. So they sack the whole firm la.

You are stupid.
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Old 23-10-2021, 03:26 PM
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Please la. Why they sack me when there are any others who are similar or worse. I am protected. Its called race to the bottom but don't be the bottom. So they sack the whole firm la.

You are stupid.
Protected? That's what you think. I call it employees fallacy. Look even Apple can operate without Steve Jobs what makes you think your firm cannot function without you? You must be highly delusional.
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  #14349 (permalink)  
Old 23-10-2021, 07:58 PM
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Please la. Why they sack me when there are any others who are similar or worse. I am protected. Its called race to the bottom but don't be the bottom. So they sack the whole firm la.

You are stupid.
what does ur boss kkj taste like ?
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  #14350 (permalink)  
Old 23-10-2021, 08:23 PM
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Please la. Why they sack me when there are any others who are similar or worse. I am protected. Its called race to the bottom but don't be the bottom. So they sack the whole firm la.

You are stupid.
Whats your end goal? Of counsel or lifetime salaried partner? In big firms, most salaried partners have pressure to progress towards EP within a certain timeframe or they'll kick you out.
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