How much are you earning per annum?

Yes. Most probably i am since i have already gone through it and belong to the high risk profile. But, i do find his comments has some positive and few logical points. Not entirely wrong or rubbish.

Once you sell your HDB, you can't buy back unless you sell your private property first. When you want to buy hdb back, the price might not be cheap anymore too. So there is that risk also of not owning both hdb and private property.

Originally Posted by Unregistered

Errr ... your comments are clearly biased, don't you think so since you are ALREADY doing what he is suggesting? LOL.

Originally Posted by Unregistered

Yes. Most probably i am since i have already gone through it and belong to the high risk profile. But, i do find his comments has some positive and few logical points. Not entirely wrong or rubbish.

Once you sell your HDB, you can't buy back unless you sell your private property first. When you want to buy hdb back, the price might not be cheap anymore too. So there is that risk also of not owning both hdb and private property.

In life there is risk and return. You have taken the high risk route and survived but just because you did it, it doesn't mean that others should take the same route. What if the person naively followed your advice and got burnt? Will you be responsible enough to help him?

This is just a forum, what he should do is seek professional advice and not from fools like many in this forum.

So why is my advise classed as stupid? I am open to disagreement but to call it stupid is ridiculous. In my experience only people who do not enjoy the luxury of such a choice form such dim opinion.

The poster mentioned I quote "I need advice from the rich uncles here" and I gave him the approach that more successful people take that I know of. If he wanted a general Singaporean Kiasi advise it would be either do not upgrade or sell his HDB and do not over leverage. I do not see a "Rich" person as someone who only owns one home and no investment property.

In my perspective he has paid in full his HDB and is young which puts him in a good position to take on further but calculated risk.

Now with the HDB investment at low rental conservative rental say 2.5K per month nett that is still 4.6% return on 650K selling price, if we factor in his original purchase price heck that will well run over 8%, as a someone who invest in property (I have over 8 properties with less than 45% loan on current value) you will have to shoot me to make me sell such a goldmine in a secure country as Singapore for 650K.

My words are likely wasted since you probably have no idea how this works or what I am talking about.

Originally Posted by Unregistered

You should not listen to this "advice". It is a dangerous proposition as you will be put in a high stake game. If you don't sell your flat, you may not have much money for downpayment and may have to take loan of 80%. If the property market falls by more than 20% you will be under water. Both your condo and flat value will drop by more than 20% each!!!

Worse, you might not be able to rent out your flat because of oversupply of properties coming and you may not also be able to sell your flat at that point. You will be stuck big time. So, don't listen to stupid "advice".

Not sure why you would want to seek advise as all since you already decided although what I find really odd is that you would consider selling your HDB to buy an even more overpriced private condo because your concerns is the market might tank?

Using Mr Dim's equation of market falling by 20% across, lets say your HDB falls by 20% you lose that's 130K. 20% on your condo at 1.2 M happens to be 240K. And he is advising you to sell HDB and buy the condo. You are aware government protect HDB prices right which means private will fall even more. Genius really.

If you so risk adverse say so lah so neither of us will need to waste our time. I will leave you in the good hands of Mr Dim to enlighten you on what to do next.

Originally Posted by Unregistered

Thanks for the note. Yes, I'm aware of the property oversupply situation. That is why I want to sell my flat first before prices fall further. Selling now would enable me to cash out at a high price. I bought it cheap many years ago.

Renting out my flat will not be easy, now it is already difficult and with so many BTOs launching, the oversupply situation will be worse. If I can't rent out my flat, then my mortgage burden for my new condo will be too high.

Thanks Bro, these jokers have no idea in the meaning of calculated risk. My own fault for wanting to offer advise. Knn Waste my time I thought this guy has some potential to make it further.

Originally Posted by Unregistered

Yes. Most probably i am since i have already gone through it and belong to the high risk profile. But, i do find his comments has some positive and few logical points. Not entirely wrong or rubbish.

Once you sell your HDB, you can't buy back unless you sell your private property first. When you want to buy hdb back, the price might not be cheap anymore too. So there is that risk also of not owning both hdb and private property.

Mr Dim, he ask for Rich people opinion and I gave it to him

If he formed intelligent questions about market timing, location what to look for etc for a good value property I would share it with him. I will not however spoon feed him

As a father of 2 I would expect he to use the information here as a differing opinions and formulate an approach suited to his risk profile. I did say his choice didn't I.

Honestly is someone is so stupid to follow advise here blindly then he deserves to be burnt. Why the need to defend this kind of action seriously.

Its an differing strategy works for some and not others, someone tell you to jump off a cliff you jump meh?

Anyway dun waste our time, you didn't make it that's your problem. Don't make it our problem.

Originally Posted by Unregistered

In life there is risk and return. You have taken the high risk route and survived but just because you did it, it doesn't mean that others should take the same route. What if the person naively followed your advice and got burnt? Will you be responsible enough to help him?

This is just a forum, what he should do is seek professional advice and not from fools like many in this forum.

Anyway, i'm the one who agreed with your advise.

In fact, i'm interested to know your advise and get input regarding market timing and location for a good value property. As i mentioned, i keep my hdb, a condo and few shared property oversea. So far the yield is quite good during these past 5 years. And as long i keep my debt ratio and interest cover within my limit, i feel quite safe.

However, moving forward, in my opinion, i feel the market is heavily controlled now. Not sure whether investing in property might be a good short term move now. But perhaps i don't see something that you see. Hence any advise will be greatly appreciated.

Originally Posted by Unregistered

Mr Dim, he ask for Rich people opinion and I gave it to him

If he formed intelligent questions about market timing, location what to look for etc for a good value property I would share it with him. I will not however spoon feed him

As a father of 2 I would expect he to use the information here as a differing opinions and formulate an approach suited to his risk profile. I did say his choice didn't I.

Honestly is someone is so stupid to follow advise here blindly then he deserves to be burnt. Why the need to defend this kind of action seriously.

Its an differing strategy works for some and not others, someone tell you to jump off a cliff you jump meh?

Anyway dun waste our time, you didn't make it that's your problem. Don't make it our problem.

I think you are underestimating the poster too much. I don't think he is stupid enough to follow the advise bluntly. Furthermore, in whatever decision he made, of course he will list down pros and cons. I believe he has thought of exit strategy too for whatever decision he made.

Well sometimes, it's good to be pre-cautious, but don't be so close minded until you can't see any opportunity. I feel the risk of being close minded is higher than renting your HDB.

So someone who said totally don't listen to his advise must be either "not so rich", or kiasu enough of not letting everyone see opportunities.

Originally Posted by Unregistered

In life there is risk and return. You have taken the high risk route and survived but just because you did it, it doesn't mean that others should take the same route. What if the person naively followed your advice and got burnt? Will you be responsible enough to help him?

This is just a forum, what he should do is seek professional advice and not from fools like many in this forum.

Originally Posted by Unregistered

Hi everyone,

- Husband and I are both in our early 60s.
- We both semi-retired in our mid 50s. We now do freelance work and take in about $10k per month, combined.
- My spouse's pension provides us with about $2k + per month.
- We own 4 private properties (including 1 landed house), all of which are rented out save for the condo we live in. All in all worth approx $10-11 million altogether. Outstanding loan is about $1 million. Rental income is about $15k per month.
- We also have about $2 million worth of property overseas, but we are thinking of selling this in the near future to pay off our debt, and also to have more savings for rainy days.
- 2 children, both in their 20s and working.
- Both recently bought new condos for which we are helping with the initial payment. Definitely intend for them to pay us back when they have to ability to.
- 1 modest japanese car, 8 years old. Not planning to get a new car anytime soon until the 10 year COE is up.
- Planning to FULLY retire in the next couple of years and simply enjoy the rest of my days.

I guess I am doing okay in today's society, where day to day life is getting more expensive. "Problem" now is that I want to help my children get a head-start in terms of an investment property, therefore my spouse and I cannot afford to retire yet, I think. I do see my children work very hard and also trying their best to save, and as a mum, I feel blessed that I can help them out financially at this point.

Congrats! I think you guys can retire, and retire VERY well.

Your children are already very lucky to have your help in the initial payment, there shouldn't be anymore need to help them get an investment property too!

Live a little, we only have one life, now's the time to do what you truly want!

I have refrained from contributing because this topic of whether to invest in/ buy private property has been discussed ad nauseum (you can see many such posts in this forum) and I saw this post as a troll post seeking to stir up emotion all over again.

On the one side you will get nay sayers: people who only see the worst case, and / or reckless people who had been badly burnt before during property down cycles. On the other side, you have people who are optimists, people who saw their fortunes grew multifold because property investment and not least property agents desperate to drum up transactions.

In my earlier sharing / argument (many many pages ago) on this topic, I pointed out one key factor in the decision making process is the stability of your job and thus the security of that wage coming in, in good times and bad. If you have a secure job like in the civil service, and still relatively young (meaning salary increases going forward), you could absorb more economic shock than the next guy who does not have a secure job.

The other point I highlighted was the property landscape then (when the rich uncles made their bundle) and now is not the same. Having said this, each scenario presents it's own opportunities and risks. Now with the government tightly controlling the market, the risk of a nasty downturn is curtailed! They just have to ease the CM when the market turns. Remember that there are many investors outside of Singapore looking for good properties. Even internally there are many cash rich singaporeans staying on the side because of the CM, and many have turned to invest overseas instead.

Then there is the intangibles of condo living - privacy, facilities and for some here, status. Although I stayed in private properties all my working life, I only moved into condo living 10 years ago. It has been a very wonderful 10 years. I can see why condo is one of the Cs in the list of desired 5Cs.

To sum up, forummers will offer their views / advise based on their specific set of circumstances. There is no right or wrong. You have to be clear of your circumstance.

Originally Posted by Unregistered

Hi,

I need advice from the rich uncles here.
I am 39 & wife is 45. We are both working in the private sector.
Our combined salaries are $158k pa.
We currently own and living in a 5 room HDB flat, which is valued at $650k and paid up.
We have two kids and they love swimming.
We are thinking of selling our flat and upgrade to a two bedroom condo worth $1.2m.
We plan to use the flat sale proceeds plus our CPF savings to pay a total downpayment of $800k and loan $400k.
Is this ok? Is this financially prudent?
Pls advise. Thanks.

Your LTV will be 33%, very prudent indeed. Go ahead.

Originally Posted by Unregistered

Hi,

I need advice from the rich uncles here.
I am 39 & wife is 45. We are both working in the private sector.
Our combined salaries are $158k pa.
We currently own and living in a 5 room HDB flat, which is valued at $650k and paid up.
We have two kids and they love swimming.
We are thinking of selling our flat and upgrade to a two bedroom condo worth $1.2m.
We plan to use the flat sale proceeds plus our CPF savings to pay a total downpayment of $800k and loan $400k.
Is this ok? Is this financially prudent?
Pls advise. Thanks.

Originally Posted by Unregistered

I actually like his advise.
Most of our fears in life (90% of it) would never appear. If it does appear, you will find a way to counter measure it. Ultimately high risk high return.

Myself, i bought condo and renting my HDB to offset the installment. The only difference is my loan tenure is longer (earning lesser as i'm still in the early 30), hence i can still play a calculated risk game here.

Also why do you want to sell a HDB when the price is dropping and the interest rate is low now?

I am another one who agrees with the advice given. I will be buying a condo soon and renting out HDB. (There are certain hoops we need to jump through given the current cooling measures.)

The worst of the worst that can happen is that property prices fall drastically by 20% or more. In this scenario, we can either (1) sell the condo at a loss, break tenancy agreement for a fee and move back to the HDB (or temporarily rent a place until tenancy is up); OR (2) bear with it and top up the loan with our cash savings should the bank do a margin call, and continue servicing the condo loan. But this is a worst case scenario. A lot of people will be worse off than us, especially those who over-leveraged themselves.

Of course, we all know full well that we all should do our own homework based on our own circumstances (financial, family preference, pressures, etc). Do your sums.