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How much are you earning per annum?

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  #5551 (permalink)  
Old 06-10-2014, 12:28 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Unregistered View Post
Wrong comparison.
Malaysia is a less developed country.
Malaysia has a high crime rate, esp in JB. High levels of corruption.
Why not you compare value of London's real estate with the whole continent of Africa?
Please compare Hongkong with ShengZhen.
In 1993, Hongkong was 1000 times better in terms of salary and was 1000 times more expensive (Cost of living and price of property).
What happen now?
Don't under rate lesser country, or one day you may have to look for livelihood in Malaysia.

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  #5552 (permalink)  
Old 06-10-2014, 12:37 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Unregistered View Post
Age: 33
Total income (2013): 127K (job) + 37K (rental income) = 164K
Property: condo (home), investment property 1 (rented out), investment property 2 (rented out). Value of all properties: 3.2M. Mortage remaining for all properties:0.85M
Cash + shares: 100K
CPF (OA+SA+MS): 155K
Car: NIL
Children: NIL

Proud of: Not owning a car despite the pressure to, from image point of view - Its only thru not buying a car that I could have owned multiple properties at 33 and with a not v high paying job.

Worries: Everyday I think about how to reduce my tax, and how to grow my nest egg. Its going to be more difficult to have children.

Regrets: I should have had children earlier. I should have spent less on branded goods, holidays and dining out when I was younger. Then could have bought another property ~

Tired of: walking and taking bus when it is raining
impressive, our net worth is just slightly more but i am 5 years older than you:

property value: $2.65M (one freehold landed home)
loan: $800K
cash + shares: $750K
unit trusts and other investments: $250K
cpf: $50K

total around $2.9M

1 car and 3 kids, household annual income $300K

i have been fortunate and blessed with earlier investments and job promotions, so at this stage in life i am less focused on chasing wealth (there will always be others who are wealthier), and more on teaching my kids the right values (which is actually harder than making money) and trying to help others.

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  #5553 (permalink)  
Old 06-10-2014, 08:25 AM
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We are a low income graduate couple in our late fifties, we earn only $117k pa combined. We are lucky to own and live in a condo, which I inherited from my parents. We have a grown up teenage son. We don't own a car as our condo provides a shuttle service to an MRT station, very convenient to our work places. We lead a simple life. We try our best to save as much as we can for old age. We are now learning to invest our savings in dividend stocks to give us dividends.

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  #5554 (permalink)  
Old 06-10-2014, 12:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Unregistered View Post
Wrong comparison.
Malaysia is a less developed country.
Malaysia has a high crime rate, esp in JB. High levels of corruption.
Why not you compare value of London's real estate with the whole continent of Africa?
Can you be sure SG will flourish forever.. and outdo JB?Malaysia forever.. Shen Zhen was once 100 times worst than HK.. in just 10-20 years... it is totally different... Sad to see SG ppl are so contented and no sense of alert...
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  #5555 (permalink)  
Old 06-10-2014, 12:58 PM
Piz2a
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Unregistered View Post
Age: 33
Total income (2013): 127K (job) + 37K (rental income) = 164K
Property: condo (home), investment property 1 (rented out), investment property 2 (rented out). Value of all properties: 3.2M. Mortage remaining for all properties:0.85M
Cash + shares: 100K
CPF (OA+SA+MS): 155K
Car: NIL
Children: NIL

Proud of: Not owning a car despite the pressure to, from image point of view - Its only thru not buying a car that I could have owned multiple properties at 33 and with a not v high paying job.

Worries: Everyday I think about how to reduce my tax, and how to grow my nest egg. Its going to be more difficult to have children.

Regrets: I should have had children earlier. I should have spent less on branded goods, holidays and dining out when I was younger. Then could have bought another property ~

Tired of: walking and taking bus when it is raining
Hi, can I just ask how you managed to afford 3 properties with a 127k/annum job? I'm 20 this year, haven't started working, but I'm curious as to the "right steps" to take for financial success in the future.

Currently, I'm invested in stocks.
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  #5556 (permalink)  
Old 06-10-2014, 01:29 PM
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(reply from the 33 yr, 127K job person)

How I acquired 3 properties despite not earning that much

- Upon getting married, I stayed with parents for a few years. This enabled us to save. Yes, we sacrificed some privacy, endured some nagging. But at the end, they are Parents and they meant well in their own way. So I put my pride aside, and thought long term of the good start to the finances, with the added advantage of keeping a close r/s with the parents. They won't be around forever, and parental love is the strongest force in the world that is mostly unconditional unlike romantic love, which can be unreliable.

- Never bought a car, despite strange looks from friends/ colleagues, some who are earning much less or more junior in the job but already have cars. Never bought a car despite parents nagging (image issues) either. Just keep walking and bus and MRT. Endure it for the long term financial health. Think about how much $ you will save by not servicing the car loan, insurance, petrol for an item that is yours only temporarily.

- Didn't blow my bonus entirely. Yes I enjoyed annual trips to far away places, and lived a very comfortable life dining out at fine restaurants least twice a week, and I love shopping. But stayed away from the branded stuff (Prada, LV, Gucci are lethal to the wallet), just buy high street stuff and only on sale (Zara etc). At the most, one branded purchase a year amounting to <3K.

- Spouse is more frugal than me. I am a spender as compared to my spouse.

- Timing played an important role for property. Do remember that just a few years ago, 80% LTV is possible for multiple properties. So I was unaffected by LTV problems, as long as I had 20% cash for downpayment (+ extra 10% for stamp duty, agent fees, lawyer fees etc) I am ready to go. Nowdays its certainly more difficult as prices are higher, there are LTV limitations (50% for 2nd residential property?), TDSR limitations, ADSD, and for HDB the MSR.

Actually, I am nothing compared to some of my acquaintances of the Same age, who were extremely bold and kept on leveraging up to buy more properties as the market moved up a few years ago. Their net worth is much more than mine.

Other thoughts: In the next few years, the residential property market is going to be much more challenging for landlords. e.g. my tenant wants to renew but is asking for a significant discount from the previous rental despite new amenities opening close by. Certainly the market will correct, but by how much and when, is the question that nobody can give a reliable answer.

So, even if u can buy, Don't Buy until there is solid REAL potential (e.g. future MRT station <200m and <5years time and amenities) and can get a good Return on Equity and convince yourself (mathematically, not emotionally) that there is excellent value in the property purchase. Property can be very dangerous too e.g. no tenant.
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  #5557 (permalink)  
Old 06-10-2014, 01:29 PM
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28, Singaporean Chinese Hokkien male.
NUS Grad '12

Annual: 0 (Jobless since last month)
Bank: 6,000
CPF: 10,000

I am the loser in the singapore economic race.
Come from middle income family.
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  #5558 (permalink)  
Old 06-10-2014, 01:42 PM
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Question to the 38 year old forumer: how did u accumulate so much cash and stocks ? Despite 3 kids to support. I am amazed
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  #5559 (permalink)  
Old 06-10-2014, 01:45 PM
Piz2a
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Unregistered View Post
(reply from the 33 yr, 127K job person)

How I acquired 3 properties despite not earning that much

- Upon getting married, I stayed with parents for a few years. This enabled us to save. Yes, we sacrificed some privacy, endured some nagging. But at the end, they are Parents and they meant well in their own way. So I put my pride aside, and thought long term of the good start to the finances, with the added advantage of keeping a close r/s with the parents. They won't be around forever, and parental love is the strongest force in the world that is mostly unconditional unlike romantic love, which can be unreliable.

- Never bought a car, despite strange looks from friends/ colleagues, some who are earning much less or more junior in the job but already have cars. Never bought a car despite parents nagging (image issues) either. Just keep walking and bus and MRT. Endure it for the long term financial health. Think about how much $ you will save by not servicing the car loan, insurance, petrol for an item that is yours only temporarily.

- Didn't blow my bonus entirely. Yes I enjoyed annual trips to far away places, and lived a very comfortable life dining out at fine restaurants least twice a week, and I love shopping. But stayed away from the branded stuff (Prada, LV, Gucci are lethal to the wallet), just buy high street stuff and only on sale (Zara etc). At the most, one branded purchase a year amounting to <3K.

- Spouse is more frugal than me. I am a spender as compared to my spouse.

- Timing played an important role for property. Do remember that just a few years ago, 80% LTV is possible for multiple properties. So I was unaffected by LTV problems, as long as I had 20% cash for downpayment (+ extra 10% for stamp duty, agent fees, lawyer fees etc) I am ready to go. Nowdays its certainly more difficult as prices are higher, there are LTV limitations (50% for 2nd residential property?), TDSR limitations, ADSD, and for HDB the MSR.

Actually, I am nothing compared to some of my acquaintances of the Same age, who were extremely bold and kept on leveraging up to buy more properties as the market moved up a few years ago. Their net worth is much more than mine.

Other thoughts: In the next few years, the residential property market is going to be much more challenging for landlords. e.g. my tenant wants to renew but is asking for a significant discount from the previous rental despite new amenities opening close by. Certainly the market will correct, but by how much and when, is the question that nobody can give a reliable answer.

So, even if u can buy, Don't Buy until there is solid REAL potential (e.g. future MRT station <200m and <5years time and amenities) and can get a good Return on Equity and convince yourself (mathematically, not emotionally) that there is excellent value in the property purchase. Property can be very dangerous too e.g. no tenant.
Thanks for sharing!

Where do you pick up all these personal finance tips? It seems like there is so much to learn! I don't even know how to get started. All I know currently is to invest, and I've read that stocks are the best for a young investor because over the LT they perform better than bonds.

And how do you tell if the market is moving up/down? Newspapers?

Sorry if I sound dumb, but they don't teach such things in school! LOL!
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  #5560 (permalink)  
Old 06-10-2014, 02:00 PM
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Haha, u are already wise for your age, to start thinking about investments and property at only 20.

When I was 20, all I thought about was getting a good grade in school and my looks

Anyway, its much easier nowadays to learn about investing with many free resources.
- Moneysmart blog is v entertaining and mostly good advice on property, saving money, credit. Plenty of other good blogs talking about property investment.
- Be willing to spend a bit of money on buying books, or go to the NLB to borrow them for free. I like reading local authors writing on the property market (residential and commercial) as they write with the SG market in mind.
- I was terrible at stocks and trading, being far too emotional to keep hold of greed and fear. But its logical that a new investor start with the STI. I should have done that years ago....
- If u have a wise, rich, trusted relative. Talk to him and find out how they made it. Having wise friends and a good spouse also helps. They won't derail you from your financial goals by blowing $ or laughing at your millionaire dreams, they will support u emotionally and offer tips or practical help.
- Other than getting a good job, think of other sideline income streams u could develop.
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