How much are you earning per annum?

Originally Posted by Unregistered

Don't stereotype all Investment bankers. Those doing those CDOs are a very small bunch. And most of the teams are in EU/ US. I started off in 2007 doing M&A.. almost lost my job during the crisis. Now, joined another IB doing Equities. Crisis is coming and I worry l will lose my job again. Never robbed anyone/cheated anyone. Starting pay is high but the hours are very very long. When I come home from work my whole family is asleep already. When I wake up for work they haven't wake up yet. I think alot of people only focus on the high pay but there are alot of sacrifices. People don't pay you money for nothing. No free lunch.

Ha, OK, the sentence should "Some Investor bankers are are nothing more than scammers...." Yeah small bunch, like only the top management? And when the management of GS, LB, MR, JPM testified in front of the senate, all of them maintained their innocence too. Right down from the analyst, relationship manager, internal auditor to the very top, most were turning a blind eye to the fiasco because they were paid so much. Am sure those people worked very very very long hours as well, to contribute to the scam of the century.

Originally Posted by Unregistered

Don't stereotype all Investment bankers. Those doing those CDOs are a very small bunch. And most of the teams are in EU/ US. I started off in 2007 doing M&A.. almost lost my job during the crisis. Now, joined another IB doing Equities. Crisis is coming and I worry l will lose my job again. Never robbed anyone/cheated anyone. Starting pay is high but the hours are very very long. When I come home from work my whole family is asleep already. When I wake up for work they haven't wake up yet. I think alot of people only focus on the high pay but there are alot of sacrifices. People don't pay you money for nothing. No free lunch.

Oh.....Small bunch in US/EU? And as if it's not the dream of EVERY investor banker to work for the what have you ............Goldman S, JP Morgan, BOA(MR)?

Sometimes, i wish I'm an Investment banker or some other big shot, become a millionaire by 35 yrs old and retire comfortably by 50 years old.

I used to believe that old school hardwork and honesty will enable me to join the exclusive millionaire club but unfortunately, as i grow older & wiser, my belief is put into question.
I see a lot of hardworking and honest people plying their respective trade but yet they are not in the high-income status. I asked myself, Why?
I finally realized that to be very successful, you need a pinch of luck and tons of "connections", know the right people. Even being super smart is not good enough.

I totally agree that having tons of money does NOT guarantee total happiness and life here in only "temporary". Period. No point arguing about it.
But i always ask myself, do i want to cry & sob my sorrows away in a small humble HDB house or in a big luxurious bungalow? I'm not sure about you guys but i choose the latter.

Good luck guys!

Originally Posted by Unregistered

Sometimes, i wish I'm an Investment banker or some other big shot, become a millionaire by 35 yrs old and retire comfortably by 50 years old.

I used to believe that old school hardwork and honesty will enable me to join the exclusive millionaire club but unfortunately, as i grow older & wiser, my belief is put into question.
I see a lot of hardworking and honest people plying their respective trade but yet they are not in the high-income status. I asked myself, Why?
I finally realized that to be very successful, you need a pinch of luck and tons of "connections", know the right people. Even being super smart is not good enough.

I totally agree that having tons of money does NOT guarantee total happiness and life here in only "temporary". Period. No point arguing about it.
But i always ask myself, do i want to cry & sob my sorrows away in a small humble HDB house or in a big luxurious bungalow? I'm not sure about you guys but i choose the latter.

Good luck guys!

You need to be lucky to get the connections. Luck is everything.

Warren Buffet was lucky to have Benjamin Graham as his teacher. Bill Gates was lucky to have Paul Allen convinced him to drop out of Harvard to found Microsoft, and later convince IBM to purchase their operating system.

Originally Posted by unregistered

sometimes, i wish i'm an investment banker or some other big shot, become a millionaire by 35 yrs old and retire comfortably by 50 years old.

I used to believe that old school hardwork and honesty will enable me to join the exclusive millionaire club but unfortunately, as i grow older & wiser, my belief is put into question.
I see a lot of hardworking and honest people plying their respective trade but yet they are not in the high-income status. I asked myself, why?
I finally realized that to be very successful, you need a pinch of luck and tons of "connections", know the right people. Even being super smart is not good enough.

I totally agree that having tons of money does not guarantee total happiness and life here in only "temporary". Period. No point arguing about it.
But i always ask myself, do i want to cry & sob my sorrows away in a small humble hdb house or in a big luxurious bungalow? I'm not sure about you guys but i choose the latter.

Good luck guys!

命里有时终须有 命里无时莫强求

Last count, there are 183,000 millionaires in SG. This figure may reach 408,000 by end 2016. The calculation takes into account housing assets (less outstanding debt). This is not too bad a figure considering our current population size (depends on whether you want to include the PR/Foreigners)

In my opinion, being a millionaire and hardwork/honesty have low correlation. It is hard to become wealthy when you work for others. The harder you work & more time you devote to working for others means less time available for you to pursue activities like investing/starting your own business. Honesty is important. I prefer the word integrity. If you are successful and have no honesty/integrity, it is a matter of time before you end up in trouble with law. (look at the hedgefund trader who went to 11years jail after trading on confidential info; or the lawyer who ran away with client's money)
But looking at the prominence of work politics, it is very important to be street-smart/high EQ as well.. whether you are doing your own business/ working for other people.

I agree that money is important and to a certain extent/point, it can bring happiness. But as many in the forum has pointed out, there are many (and I stress again) other contributants to a happy/fulfiled life.

"But i always ask myself, do i want to cry & sob my sorrows away in a small humble HDB house or in a big luxurious bungalow?"

This is an interesting statement because I had a similar strain of discussion with my partner. I've stayed in private housing all my life, currently staying with my parents in a landed house in the central part of SG. My partner have stayed in HDB all her life, and currently still stays with her family in a 4room HDB flat, in the east. Her family is no less happier than mine.

My parents constantly remind me (& my brothers) that happiness for them is family & health- Things that are not dependent on money. My dad has many times wanted us to move to a smaller house as he complains that 4 of us brothers spend so much time in our own rooms that we don't spend time in the common hall, watching television like we used to do. (something that my partner and her siblings still do with parents)

This maybe my personal experience & personal view. Sharing it because this experience had changed my view towards wealth vs happiness.

Originally Posted by Unregistered

Sometimes, i wish I'm an Investment banker or some other big shot, become a millionaire by 35 yrs old and retire comfortably by 50 years old.

I used to believe that old school hardwork and honesty will enable me to join the exclusive millionaire club but unfortunately, as i grow older & wiser, my belief is put into question.
I see a lot of hardworking and honest people plying their respective trade but yet they are not in the high-income status. I asked myself, Why?
I finally realized that to be very successful, you need a pinch of luck and tons of "connections", know the right people. Even being super smart is not good enough.

I totally agree that having tons of money does NOT guarantee total happiness and life here in only "temporary". Period. No point arguing about it.
But i always ask myself, do i want to cry & sob my sorrows away in a small humble HDB house or in a big luxurious bungalow? I'm not sure about you guys but i choose the latter.

Good luck guys!

Don't let some bad eggs taint the rest. In every profession, there are bad eggs. Even those who manufacture milk (see CN milk scandal). Banks play an important role (investment banks included) in the matching resources (financial capital) to the users of capital (e.g manufacturing companies etc). I am not an expert on CDOs, but understand them to be a collection of various debt obligations (i.e beneath it all, these are companies (both good and bad) looking to borrow money) packaged for onward distribution to investors (i.e the owners of Capital)

I agree that what some people within the chain have done (e.g. GS traders shorting the same CDOs that the sales persons are promoting/selling) are unethical, and most are illegal.
But wanted to point out that CDOs are essentially just a means of raising money, a process that is fundamental/important to the "real" economy (e.g. manufacturing, services etc)

Originally Posted by Unregistered

Ha, OK, the sentence should "Some Investor bankers are are nothing more than scammers...." Yeah small bunch, like only the top management? And when the management of GS, LB, MR, JPM testified in front of the senate, all of them maintained their innocence too. Right down from the analyst, relationship manager, internal auditor to the very top, most were turning a blind eye to the fiasco because they were paid so much. Am sure those people worked very very very long hours as well, to contribute to the scam of the century.

Originally Posted by Unregistered

Don't let some bad eggs taint the rest. In every profession, there are bad eggs. Even those who manufacture milk (see CN milk scandal). Banks play an important role (investment banks included) in the matching resources (financial capital) to the users of capital (e.g manufacturing companies etc). I am not an expert on CDOs, but understand them to be a collection of various debt obligations (i.e beneath it all, these are companies (both good and bad) looking to borrow money) packaged for onward distribution to investors (i.e the owners of Capital)

I agree that what some people within the chain have done (e.g. GS traders shorting the same CDOs that the sales persons are promoting/selling) are unethical, and most are illegal.
But wanted to point out that CDOs are essentially just a means of raising money, a process that is fundamental/important to the "real" economy (e.g. manufacturing, services etc)

But do you know what these banks have done to cause the subprime crisis?

1: They lend to people who had low/bad credit ratings.
2: In the tradition banking model, banks will be prudent in giving out such loans, as they had to bear the risk of defaults.
3: So what did the banks do? The decoupled themselves from these risks by packaging the subprime loans as CDOs. Well, money was raised indeed but to fill the banks' own pockets.
4: Not only that, the same banks also bought insurance against these CDOs failing and insurers like AIG were merrily accepting the premium, like most felt that as long as the property prices keeps going up, nothing will happen.
5: Yes, banks plays the role of the middle man, redistributing resources, but they have been consumed by GREED. Don't tell me it's only a small group of bad eggs, it's the entire upper echelon of these investment banks PLUS the bankers who approved the subprime loans, PLUS the bankers who pushed out the CDOs to the retail investors with "guaranteed" and safe returns, PLUS the rating agencies who give AAA to these CDOs, PLUS the analysts who recommended the CDOs to the public.......the lists goes on and on....... the banks were supposed to ascertain the risks and protect the interest of the investors, not simply pass all the risk to the investors. Any scammer could do that.

45, male

$120K per annum

financial services industry, 15 years of experience, front line

am i lowly paid?

"But i always ask myself, do i want to cry & sob my sorrows away in a small humble HDB house or in a big luxurious bungalow?"

Ha....if the reason why you are crying is because of your stretched resources, from buying
the big luxurious bungalow, then it a whole different story.

Bottom line is: Live within your means.

Person A: Borrow to the hilt to live in a condo and drives a BMW.
If he loses his job, he's a goner.
or

Person B: Debt free. Lives in a HDB, drives a Toyota.
Has 2 years of savings to see him through a recession.

For me, the choice is clear.