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signing on in army(short term) vs working outside

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  #11 (permalink)  
Old 04-10-2011, 08:50 PM
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Quote:
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I dun think above poster was asking everyone to caveat or talk like lawyer. He just challenging the assumption on that long post that imply Army is always some zhobolan place and private sector is some slave driver.

For me my advise to TS is if he really have no interest in Army better dun sign up. The few NS friends I have who sign up just to get easy money all regret because later very hard to transit to civilian job.
There are happy ones too.

In any job - private sector, army, civil service, you name it - there will be unhappy employees. Army regulars are more visible cos we males saw with our own eyes the uselessness and wayangness of certain things, pardon my french. Especially when now we have to defend 50% foreigners who don't need to serve a [email protected]#$% single day.

My point is that we males associate lots of negativity with the armed forces, and naturally we are more biased when comparing an army career with a civilian one.

That said, I do have a friend who still likes his army career a lot despite being just a specialist. Another friend is also quite happy in the police force.

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  #12 (permalink)  
Old 04-10-2011, 09:15 PM
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Why not join a stat board instead of the army?
A stat board is great place for diploma holders to pursue their part-time degrees.. though the pay may not be super high for a diploma holder since you will just be a management support staff but the environment is conclusive for furthering your education.. Seldom need to work late so you can leave on time for your night classes...
Furthermore, since the government is always pro-upgrading.. the ministry have to support this ethos also.. some stats boards will grant you 12 days of study leave every year to go for your exam preparation... Unlikely got retrenchment.. you just have to stay focus and endure thru the 4 years..
And if your performance is good during your stay with them, they might even offer you a graduate post after you finish your degree...
However if you still want to leave the place anyway... chances is that it might be easier to get a job with your stat board experience than with army experience....
This is just sharing from my personal experience... i almost signed on with the air-force after ORD but later decided not to..
Already graduated and got em-placed into a graduate job.... But still... what had worked for me might not work for you... You might decide that Army suit you more... So i guess you have to decide what you want yah.. Good luck...

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  #13 (permalink)  
Old 04-10-2011, 09:17 PM
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I'm a specialist. In the army now. I can say not much interests la except I'm ok with the life here. But Sometimes u do the same thing too many times it can become really really sian.

I'm just very concerned abt the next 4yrs, comparing signon option I will be without debts and maybe even have quite abit of money to spend without worrying much, although I assume army equals to zero work experience outside. Also the fear of getting too sian of the thing in army because many times I feel it's pointless just wayang kind.
Another option comes with debts of abt $18k for sim degree, but I have 2yrs of full time work skills w my diploma and 2 yrs of part time skills while I study for the degree.

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  #14 (permalink)  
Old 04-10-2011, 09:22 PM
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Stat board has a contract of 4 years also?
Anyway any example of company under stat board? Is it just civil service job?
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  #15 (permalink)  
Old 04-10-2011, 10:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Unregistered View Post
You are embarking on a quest to pursue your life and that's impressive for someone of your age.

I suggest taking up the offer and studying part time whilst in army.

For those who oppose this option, may I ask - what's the viable and betterer suggestion? After all, besides joining the army, he would be working in the private sector and we know that working in the private sector encompass extreme hard work and downsizing of profile by the employers nowadays.

Besides, we are facing an imminent danger of recession in Singapore that may take another few years to form up. The army is a blanket to shelter you from the shocks facing the economy. I don't suppose you would want to worry about your next month paycheck whilst studying for your exams. Even if retrenchment is not on the cards, given your age and starting pay, we would need to be realistic about how the employers squeeze you while retrenching other people! The job market would be bleak, should recession come.

For those who are in semicon industry, you would know that your orders are slowing down since last month, and it takes 6 mths or so before it tickles to the other industries such as banking, manufacturing, shipping, etc.

You are going to study anyway, but the decision is only: in the army, or private sector. Granted, the experience in the army does not bring you many places. But HR is not a pail of water in the toilet - they gauge your degree pay based on the date of which you obtain your degree. Hence, your 'diploma' experience is still, only diploma consideration for them; and that in turn makes your private sector experience irrelevant as well. It would be the same.

Of course, that would depend which industry you are going in. If you are going in Sales line, that wouldn't be a problem because Sales are dictated not by certs, but by solid performance. And that Sales experience is able to be carried forward. Now, if you are thinking, you would say: "But since Sales is based on performance, then what does my cert bring me to?" Precisely! Degree and diploma is not critical in Sales, in number, in figures. It is merely a tool to progress to management.... in the future.

Alot of people suggest that joining the army is as good as eating wasted rice, but that's the idea because you wouldn't want to have a lack of time to study for your degree.

Trust me. Because my wife has been studying for her SIM degree for the past 4 years and have yet to pass because of her work schedule. She always have to make choices to stay back for meetings (after work, mind you), and go classes. If she stayed back in office, she would miss classes. If she went for classes, she would be marked by her superiors because everyone else stayed.

Unless you are confident of finding a job where the schedule matches your preference, the army is a more suitable choice.
This is good advice... obviously if TS parents are v rich, he won't ask this kind of question. Its because his family is not well to do so he is considering to go down this path.

I would say really go and examine your financial situation. Borrow is better than letting the army sponsor. I borrowed $20k for my uni studies and paid them off within one yr.
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  #16 (permalink)  
Old 04-10-2011, 11:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Liverpool View Post
This is good advice... obviously if TS parents are v rich, he won't ask this kind of question. Its because his family is not well to do so he is considering to go down this path.

I would say really go and examine your financial situation. Borrow is better than letting the army sponsor. I borrowed $20k for my uni studies and paid them off within one yr.
Liverpool you dam funny leh, in the post you quote recommend staying in the army for $$$ and do nothing while studying for degree <- you say is good advice. Then followed by next line recommend borrow $$$ better than join army...
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  #17 (permalink)  
Old 04-10-2011, 11:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Unregistered View Post
Liverpool you dam funny leh, in the post you quote recommend staying in the army for $$$ and do nothing while studying for degree <- you say is good advice. Then followed by next line recommend borrow $$$ better than join army...
lol what I meant was that the person I quoted posted good advice for considerations only...

but if its up to me, I will borrow but then again I am not TS family, maybe his family really hard off and trying to make ends meet so sign on is a better option...
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  #18 (permalink)  
Old 05-10-2011, 07:32 AM
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Default Sign on or working outside

Deadrick,
I think i can help to answer your doubt.

I was 22 yrs old four years back. I signed the short term contract with the SAF as an Army Officer(2 Years) and serve a total of 4 years in the Force. I'm 26 now and I'm currently working in HSBC and will soon be heading to UOB Kay Hian or Kim Eng Securities in future.

You are probably facing the same situation as mine (When i was 22).
1. Our family are unable to fund our future education.
2. How do i pay for my degree course? should i sign on?
3. Fear of irrelevant skills to compete in the commercial world.
4. Late start. (Later then most of my male friends)
5. I don't really want to serve long in Army, just want the money for degree.


Let's start with my experience on the signing on in SAF first

Pros:
First of all, yes, Your starting pay will be ~$2.2K for Officer. Specialist will be also above $2k as well.
You will probably earn ~$2.9K by the time you are Full lieutenant (3rd-4th year) as of what i experienced. So you will probably get ~$50K (with bonus) through out the years of proper saving and that's excluding the sign on bonus of $25k.
This amount will give you a kick start faster then most of your friends and settle your degree fee. But be careful, alot of my army colleagues went to buy themselves a car and end up spending all. So you really got to exercise proper money management.

Cons:
Outfields, outfields and outfields. Guard duties(e.g Camp/Complex Duty Officer). You will not have enough time for going to lessons. If you already on a part time degree, you will definitely miss out many lessons. My friend failed miserably and took 5 years to complete his studies in SIM.


Q1: FUNDING FOR DEGREE FEE?
If your concern is funding for a degree? There are many banks out there willing to offer you Student Loan and the rates are really good. You can start paying the loan back after you landed a job with your degree. I took RHB Student Loan. Lowest rate i can find.

Don't consider loaning from banks as a debt, they are there to help and assist you getting a degree.


Q2: SERVING IN ARMED FORCES WITH IRRELEVANT SKILLS?
As of your concern whether Armed Forces has relevant skills in commercial? Yes.
If you are an Officer/Specialist, you will gain managerial skills through out the NS period. Engaging with people, learn to work with people from staff and management level. Planning, organize and managing small or large group of people. Gain confidence and etc. I had an offer in Certis Cisco for an Inspector position after I ORDed (Although i did not accept, because i'm not heading to that career path). They are offering me $3000 - $3500 + additional monthly incentive up to 1 month pay. It was relatively a good starting pay i have to admit.


Probably you want to see the situation is this way

1. If I SIGN ON...

Pros:
Take part time course while in the Armed Forces. Probably can acquire degree faster and some accumulate some savings.

Cons:
But has possibilities that you will miss out many lessons (Depends on your Unit, Mine is okay). You will probably fail some modules due to the high commitment in the armed forces, and might need to extent your degree duration.


2. If I don't and starts to WORK NOW...

Pros:
Take part time course while taking up some admin or support roles in the related field to your degree. stack up 1 or 2 years relevant experience in the field you want to go into. Commitment probably lesser (Because job scope is very generalized). Probably have more time for the study of your degree.

Cons:
Does not have the assurance to pay up your degree when pursuing it. But if you SAVE UP properly, it is not an issue anymore.


Whether your Armed Forces experiences can consider as an experience really depends how smart you pen it down in your resume and articulate it well in your interview.

There are many articles in the internet on transition from military experience to commercial experience. This is also a good article for those who are in the Armed Forces now and going to Civilian workplace soon.

"Military to Civilian
How To Best Present Yourself to Companies"

Military to Civilian Transition - Marketing Yourself to Companies


The question is getting your degree FAST with GOOD GRADES. That would probably leads you to a better salaried job in near future.

Don't worry too much about the money, worry on getting good degree is the priority.

Hope this sharing helps. Good luck to you and your studies.
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  #19 (permalink)  
Old 05-10-2011, 01:32 PM
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You should just sign on and stay in the army. Seriously, it is iron rice bowl and guaranteed minimum 5k as warrant officer by 40 as long as no major screw up.

Why bother to join army then get out? By that time you will be in late 20s without relevant experience and a useless part time degree trying to fight with all the early 20s local and foregin full time uni grads.

Come out take pay cut, less bonus (unless in a bank), less benefits and from tekaning NSF to dio tekan by some manager, think carefully before doing stupid things.
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  #20 (permalink)  
Old 30-10-2011, 12:37 PM
Henry
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do married regulars get to stay out 8-5?
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