is my civil service pay progression fast/slow/normal?

Originally Posted by miwashi

it is very discouraging as I have never been promoted at all anywhere after working for 8 years. I don't think my performance is bad as I usually get a 2-2.5 month bonus.

So when you go from MX12 to MX11 there is a significant salary jump compared to a regular increment without advancing to the next grade?

You should try out some of the advice given by other forummers such as asking for transfer to another department.

There is a salary jump, which would be significant for those whose salary is still far from the lower band of the grade to which they are promoted. If you are already within the salary range of the next grade, I think the jump is probably akin to another increment, which may not be insignificant too.

[miwashi]

I've asked for transfers 3 times over the last 5 years plus, each time I never hear anything after that. I get the idea that my boss doesn't want to let me leave the branch I'm in (it is almost entirely grasscutter types with lower education), that's why I'm already trying to get out by resigning.

Originally Posted by miwashi

hmm.. what makes you think i work there? I work in a grasscutting organization.

Hi - based on your descriptions I can probably pinpoint the division you come from; and based on your designation, I can probably narrow you down to 1 of 10 managers; if I knew your gender, I could probably narrow it down to 1 of 3 males or 7 ladies. The govt directory is great

But I shan't digress. Our stat board doesn't subscribe to the MX scheme... ours is slightly different... I'm a couple of grades from superscale, but 4 grades up from being a fresh grad.

Now I don't know if you want any unsolicited advice; but I'm gonna give it anyway;

Whichever company you work for, the bottom line is delivering high enough a value add to justify a promotion. litter doesn't get you promoted. I observe that your analytical and writing far exceed those of many of your colleagues, I'm sure, bosses included.

Use those skills.

Prepare policy papers, attend meetings at MND; get yourself invited to your board meetings & exco meetings. OR get yourself seconded to a department that has these duties. Which Director goes to MND all the time? find him and ask for a job. suggesting that your potential and abilites are underutilised is the best reason to land a secondment. (a. you flatter the hiring manager by suggesting how impt he is, and b. show genuine interest in the nparks strategy).

Now should you decide to leave - why not try another stat board; you won't get a pay cut and the upside is likely to be there. I suggest waiting till May when the game of merry go round is played following the PB announcements.

Good luck - esp if your boss has BS as initials.

[miwashi]

Thank you for the advice. I also believe litter won't get you promoted; ultimately everything has similar effort, so I should be doing something meaningful AND getting recognized for it. Just like everywhere else, same effort, small projects, small people, and big projects, big people, who can help you next time.

I don't think I won't get a pay cut if I go to another board; in these 5 years after 262 applications and 40 interviews I've gotten only 2 offers, and both came with the $800-1000 pay cuts I mentioned earlier on. Some of the interviewers even laughed when I explained what I did here. And these are not interviewers from the private sector!

In the place I'm at I noticed being secretaries at meetings gets you noticed, even though you're doing nothing much other than advancing slides and taking minutes - which in my opinion is another useless skill as you are immediately obsoleted by a tape recorder. I was involved in a lot of these last time, and I think I did it well as I produced the gold standard (as described by some ministries) of having minutes out in less than 24 hours. But I'm not involved anymore.. I don't miss it though, though I actually liked it (I do like writing), I'd rather be developing useful skills that have value in the real world; that's the bottomline.

I did attend some meetings at the palace long ago though, but all I did was prepare the slides for the big D who presented it, and advance the slides for him. The elites there probably didn't even know who I was at the end of it all.

At the end of it all, after 5 years here (and 2.5 years in a ministry before this) I am still just one grade up from a fresh grad of MX13. My peers at the ministry (we are all the same age, joined as fresh grads together back then) reached MX11 2 years ago.

BTW are you from the organization you think I'm from?

Originally Posted by miwashi

BTW are you from the organization you think I'm from?

Nope... far far away my friend - different ministry too.

From your story, sounds like you've got a mediocre CEP grade. The good news is that CEPs are not cast in stone. all you need to do is impress the right person a couple of times.

RE: Minutes - I think many public servants don't get that writing minutes is meant to gain exposure into Sr. Management thought processes. (note: pls take minutes for KEY meetings; not the ones involving only directors); I've just moved up from writing to vetting minutes; but the pain is not forgotten... in hindsight, I think it was a great opportunity.

I think writing is a valuable asset in stat boards, as is speaking; how comfy are you with presentations? a lil' confidence in bringing across a good point can go a long way in establishing ur credibility as a worker.

I am no high flyer - & obviously too far behind to join the admin service; but I think I do all right for myself just by being a bit more proactive than some of my colleagues. I'm sure you can too.

[miwashi]

Ah. that's the thing. I probably have some savant syndrome, and it's not in showmanship, probably one of the key necessities for high CEP. I'm just a writer, that's why my career of choice is in publications and editorial, and that's not what most boards and ministries offer.

Anyway I won't be waiting till may to job hunt, everyday is a job hunting day to me. With all that talk about raising Singaporeans' income by 30%, I'll be happy with a job offer that doesn't cut more than $500.

Whom have u approached for a transfer? If it's HR or ur boss it doesn't count. You need to proactively find the department, speak to the director, and only after he/she is convinced of wanting to hire you that u let the hiring D contact your Manager (AD?)

Originally Posted by Unregistered

You should try out some of the advice given by other forummers such as asking for transfer to another department.

There is a salary jump, which would be significant for those whose salary is still far from the lower band of the grade to which they are promoted. If you are already within the salary range of the next grade, I think the jump is probably akin to another increment, which may not be insignificant too.

I am from a stat board too. From where I come from, people don't get promoted until their salary hit n% of the grade's ceiling.

I think that's silly because then nobody will start working hard until they are near that n%.

[miwashi]

You know that guy called BS?

Originally Posted by miwashi

I probably have some savant syndrome, and it's not in showmanship, probably one of the key necessities for high CEP.

1. haha... actually I see some of my Ds and have no idea how they get there... (if eloquence is a key criteria) I don't think it's a necessity, it's just a big plus... (which in turn explains how those Ds with no substance gets where they are).

2. I don't know BS (I hear alot of it

3. Yet another piece of unsolicited advice: How I think I got my promotion, was because of my boss. How credible your boss is in fighting for your 2-3 consecutive B grades during the ranking exercise will undoubtedly contribute towards how successful you are in your career. My then boss has also since been promoted (next in line to the throne)... so here it is plain & simple: Work well for the golden boy & the rewards will be easier to attain.

4. Another thing about your current role; you do unfortunately portray it in the worst possible light here, I'm curious if you do the same on you CV & during interviews? Coz' I would really suggest some spin doctoring... eg. do you really measure trees; or do you manage a team of of staff responsible for collecting data on flora in Singapore - subsequently collating & analysing the data for senior management to make proactive strategic decisions on the landscape in our community parks?