Whats your net worth - Page 50 - Salary.sg Forums
Salary.sg Forums  

Go Back   Salary.sg Forums > The Salary.sg Discussion Forums: > Investments and Net Worth

Investments and Net Worth Talk all about money making exploits, shares, property and building net worth




Whats your net worth

Reply
 
Thread Tools
  #491 (permalink)  
Old 23-12-2011, 08:01 AM
Unregistered
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Unregistered View Post
Despite the disagreements here, everyone is full of admiration for Oldman. Some admire his foresight in investments, some admire his steady high income.

Has anyone realised that both "foresight" and "steady high income" are actually common attributes of the same type of person?

In contrast, we see here in this forum many people with Oldman's exact opposite attributes, who have only "hindsight" and "steady low income", constantly predicting that the property market is going to crash because of this and that crisis.

In the 1980's, Singapore experienced a very severe recession.

Singapore and the Recession of 1985

While Oldman was deliberating whether to buy his semi-d for $450k, I'm sure there were also the same type of negative people telling him that the property market was going to crash and that he could perhaps buy his semi-d for maybe $350k if he had waited another few years.

Obviously, Oldman, being a high calibre executive of a Fortune 10 oil company with guts made of steel, ignored these naysayers and went ahead with his property purchases.

Look at the piece of news below, do you see amongst the buyers an ambitious young man working in a Fortune 10 oil company?

Straits Times Dec 13, 2011

New private home sales trickling in despite cooling measures
Freehold project near Kovan 80% sold despite market-cooling moves



SingXpress Land has sold 17 of the 21 units at its Charlton Residences development near Kovan MRT station. The buyers of the freehold houses are all Singaporeans, the firm's executive director said. -- PHOTO: SINGXPRESS LAND

SingXpress Land has sold around 80 percent of its units at Charlton Residences, a 21-unit freehold luxury development in the Kovan area, at an average price of S$2.8 million each (around S$500 psf).

“We are very pleased with the strong sales of Charlton Residences. It demonstrates the demand for housing with quality design and situated at a good location which the project offers,” said Chan Heng Fai, Managing Director of SingXpress Land.
Are u a property agent?

There is no doubt, a good property investment will generate wealth, especially in Singapore. However there is also such a thing as a bad property investment and bad timing. While Oldman and a lot of other Richmen have succeeded and have posted their successes here, this forum hardly ever hears from the Suaymen who bought in 1997.

Reply With Quote
  #492 (permalink)  
Old 23-12-2011, 08:25 AM
Unregistered
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Unregistered View Post
Are u a property agent?

There is no doubt, a good property investment will generate wealth, especially in Singapore. However there is also such a thing as a bad property investment and bad timing. While Oldman and a lot of other Richmen have succeeded and have posted their successes here, this forum hardly ever hears from the Suaymen who bought in 1997.
Haha well put. In hindsight, the reasons for the spectacular rise in pty prices from 1980 are ad follows:
- rise from 3rd world to 1st
- drop in interest rate from above 10% to the all time lows today
- property was fundamentally affordable back then (hdb price was 20x starting grad income. Now its 80x. Private houses hv gone up even more)
- there was arbitrage opportunities back then (if u work in us or Australia for a couple of yrs, you can get a very nice house here as jobs in first world countries pay 5 to 10x as much as Singapore companies . Now that arbitrage is not there anymore )

Sparing us the old liquidity argument, which stimuli do u still see out there today ?

Reply With Quote
  #493 (permalink)  
Old 23-12-2011, 10:15 PM
Unregistered
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Unregistered View Post
There is no doubt, a good property investment will generate wealth, especially in Singapore. However there is also such a thing as a bad property investment and bad timing. While Oldman and a lot of other Richmen have succeeded and have posted their successes here, this forum hardly ever hears from the Suaymen who bought in 1997.
1997 and Bishan 8 condo are often quoted as the case study for the worst possible year and project in property investment.

Even salary.sg had this write up dated July 11th, 2010 "At Property Peaks, Don’t Buy"
"Among the 4 leasehold properties listed in the ST article, the worst performing one is Bishan 8. It is now selling at only $802 psf, which is 27% lower than its $1,100 psf launch price!" At Property Peaks, Don’t Buy | Salary.sg - Your Salary in Singapore

Just an update, Bishan 8 is now back to $1,100 psf as of Q3 2011, so the owners have broken even after 14 years.

Instead of illustrating the weakness of property investment, this case study in fact demonstrates its strength in that even the worst performer has broken even.

What about similarly risky investments like stocks? If we compare apple with apple, the worst performing stock investment like Pan Electric where investors lost all their money, would be equivalent to Bishan 8 selling for $0 psf today.

Reply With Quote
  #494 (permalink)  
Old 23-12-2011, 10:35 PM
Unregistered
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Haha poor oldman has gone into hiding...
Reply With Quote
  #495 (permalink)  
Old 23-12-2011, 10:41 PM
Unregistered
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Unregistered View Post
- property was fundamentally affordable back then
This is one of those statements which remain true throughout history. Even when Oldman was a young man, his $450k semi-d would probably have cost the original owner less than $10k.

Fresh graduate salary should not be used to benchmark private housing affordibility because the only thing that gets printed faster than money is degrees.

Instead, a better gauge of how much income has risen would be to look at the ministerial salary benchmark, which has gone up almost a hundred times.

Most people tend to get very emotional about this and and accuse ministers of overpaying themselves, when in fact they are actually trying very hard to hold down the benchmark.

Every now and then, some data creep into public view like the famous doctor and the fee she charged her royalty client, or some posts in this forum that are accused of being BS, when in fact they are not. These are the real benchmarks.
Reply With Quote
  #496 (permalink)  
Old 23-12-2011, 11:15 PM
Unregistered
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Unregistered View Post
1997 and Bishan 8 condo are often quoted as the case study for the worst possible year and project in property investment.

Even salary.sg had this write up dated July 11th, 2010 "At Property Peaks, Don’t Buy"
"Among the 4 leasehold properties listed in the ST article, the worst performing one is Bishan 8. It is now selling at only $802 psf, which is 27% lower than its $1,100 psf launch price!" At Property Peaks, Don’t Buy | Salary.sg - Your Salary in Singapore

Just an update, Bishan 8 is now back to $1,100 psf as of Q3 2011, so the owners have broken even after 14 years.

Instead of illustrating the weakness of property investment, this case study in fact demonstrates its strength in that even the worst performer has broken even.

What about similarly risky investments like stocks? If we compare apple with apple, the worst performing stock investment like Pan Electric where investors lost all their money, would be equivalent to Bishan 8 selling for $0 psf today.
Taking 14 years to reach the same psf, is not breaking even at all. Need to factor in the negative equity risk and high interest rates in the past. Yes, property can be a good investment, no question about that. If u can hold long enough through the market cycles, property is almost bao jiak. The question is, how long can u hold, why hold for 14 years just to break even, when if u buy at the trough, u just need to hold for far less than 14 years and make a decent profit?

Also, why buy property NOW, when the situation in 2012 is probably closer to the 1997 situation (peak) than the 2005 or 2009 situation (trough)?

If u are so rich as to not be bothered about a drop in property value, and have long holding power, then no harm can be done to u no matter what. But not everyone is that rich.

I won't bother arguing with the eternal property bulls anymore. Long property is right in the very long run, but timing is crucial. Price does not increase in a straight line, it goes up and down while generally increasing. In between, many things can happen, fortunes can be made and broken. Basically, don't get into trouble by buying property at the wrong time, that is all I am trying to say.
Reply With Quote

  #497 (permalink)  
Old 25-12-2011, 07:21 AM
Unregistered
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default

I know of stupid people who sold their property in 2007 and started renting. When prices fell in early 2009, they did not buy because they said prices will fall further. I told them that prices will recover fast but they didn't believe me. Now they are all worried as prices continue to rise. Now they are buying before their cash got burnt out.
Reply With Quote
  #498 (permalink)  
Old 25-12-2011, 07:32 AM
Unregistered
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default

I used to earn about $140k as a front office professional in the financial services sector. Now I am only earning about $100k in a lesser role, due to restructuring. I've been in the industry for more than 13 years. Though my salary now is lower, I am not bothered as I have accumulated enough wealth due to my savviness. I have a fully paid 3 storey huge landed property and another investment property. My passive income from investments is about $2k per month. I think I am slightly above average for a 45 years old Singaporean.
Or do you think I have not achieved enough?
Reply With Quote
  #499 (permalink)  
Old 25-12-2011, 08:55 PM
Unregistered
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Unregistered View Post
I used to earn about $140k as a front office professional in the financial services sector. Now I am only earning about $100k in a lesser role, due to restructuring. I've been in the industry for more than 13 years. Though my salary now is lower, I am not bothered as I have accumulated enough wealth due to my savviness. I have a fully paid 3 storey huge landed property and another investment property. My passive income from investments is about $2k per month. I think I am slightly above average for a 45 years old Singaporean.
Or do you think I have not achieved enough?
Yours is just typical. Run of the mill. Most salaryman uncles by your age have at least 2 landed, 3 mistresses and 4 Italian sports cars.


Primary School English Grammar and Vocabulary Drills
Primary School English Grammar and Vocabulary Drills


SG Bus Timing App
SG Bus Timing App - the best bus app - available on iOS and Android


Bursa Stocks Android App - check share prices
Bursa Stocks [Android] App - check latest share prices on the go


SGX Stocks Android App - check share prices
SGX Stocks [Android] App - check latest share prices on the go


SGX Stocks for iPad - check latest Singapore share prices
SGX Stocks [iPad] app
| SGX Stocks [iPhone] app
Reply With Quote
  #500 (permalink)  
Old 25-12-2011, 11:11 PM
Unregistered
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default

50 years old.
Earns a lowly $90k a year.
Owns a fully paid $900k condo.
Savings and investments of $500k.
Thinking of retiring in a 3rd world country.
What do you think?
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Tags
net wealth, net worth, networth

« Previous Thread | Next Thread »
Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Calculate Net Worth and Benchmark It Salary.sg Investments and Net Worth 16 23-09-2023 10:41 PM
legal profession not worth it? alarme Income and Jobs 3 05-04-2010 03:35 PM

» 30 Recent Threads
Career as Teacher ( 1 2 3... Last Page)
10,834 Replies, 6,666,550 Views
Is getting a PMP worth it ?
4 Replies, 7,102 Views
Q: Big4 - Yearly salary increment ( 1 2 3... Last Page)
15,309 Replies, 4,983,547 Views
Lawyer Salary ( 1 2 3... Last Page)
21,014 Replies, 10,329,569 Views
GovTech ( 1 2 3... Last Page)
5,161 Replies, 2,163,644 Views
MAS for Mid Career Professionals ( 1 2 3... Last Page)
1,801 Replies, 1,044,309 Views
LTA (Land Transport Authority) ( 1 2 3... Last Page)
679 Replies, 388,386 Views
Visa Graduate Development Program ( 1 2 3... Last Page)
207 Replies, 134,619 Views
SIM-UOL fresh grad starting pay ( 1 2 3... Last Page)
6,922 Replies, 2,902,691 Views
UOB Management Associate Program ( 1 2 3... Last Page)
1,455 Replies, 784,444 Views
Nparks ( 1 2 3... Last Page)
39 Replies, 34,379 Views
MINDEF DXO (All FAQ on it) ( 1 2 3... Last Page)
5,828 Replies, 4,656,914 Views
ITE Polytechnic Scheme ( 1 2 3... Last Page)
309 Replies, 369,043 Views
Civil Service Performance Bonus ( 1 2 3... Last Page)
5,338 Replies, 4,770,571 Views
Compare civil service salary ( 1 2 3... Last Page)
16,342 Replies, 12,455,752 Views
Civil Service Current Estimated... ( 1 2 3... Last Page)
169 Replies, 309,151 Views
Constituency Manager (People... ( 1 2 3... Last Page)
989 Replies, 813,952 Views
Julius Baer Graduate Program 2023 ( 1 2 3)
21 Replies, 14,807 Views
Roles in accenture singapore ( 1 2 3... Last Page)
7,385 Replies, 2,324,231 Views
HTX (Home Team Science and... ( 1 2 3... Last Page)
752 Replies, 358,452 Views
Shopee fresh grad pay ( 1 2 3... Last Page)
1,049 Replies, 440,583 Views
DSTA (under Mindef) ( 1 2 3... Last Page)
1,464 Replies, 1,375,238 Views
ST Electronics ( 1 2 3... Last Page)
3,767 Replies, 1,544,924 Views
IMDA (under MCI) ( 1 2 3... Last Page)
1,260 Replies, 613,617 Views
Civil Svc/ Statboard - Typical... ( 1 2 3... Last Page)
6,123 Replies, 3,738,587 Views
MX12 reappointed at MX11
8 Replies, 818 Views
Hospital (Private or Public)... ( 1 2 3... Last Page)
749 Replies, 405,562 Views
NCS (SingTel subsidiary) ( 1 2 3... Last Page)
1,329 Replies, 1,142,185 Views
MFA- Foreign Service... ( 1 2 3... Last Page)
54 Replies, 84,981 Views
Cybersecurity/Info security career ( 1 2 3... Last Page)
511 Replies, 268,608 Views
Powered by vBadvanced CMPS v3.2.2



All times are GMT +8. The time now is 06:39 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.5
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 3.3.2