Are you a mid-career SB joiner?

I guess you should really change to another statboard or ministry. I graduated in 2013 and joined the private sector. Recently just received an offer for a statboard, getting $4.3k.

How about those in your stat board like your colleagues? Maybe ask about their pay to see if yours is about the same as theirs?

Btw, for all the replies in this forum, take them as a pinch of salt. After all anybody can post anything in this forum,

yes, was in private all along and underpaid there.

i'm comparing with my peers in the same SB.

Well, the problem with mid career is they base of your last salary. The current rate is now pretty std:

2nd Upper: $3.6k
1st Class: $3.85k

With the recent 5% adjustment should be more now. Assuming one beh kan farm all the way every year get MI $250 with no promotion, with 6 years a reasonable sum is about $5k.

Oic. Didnt know that. Yups. $400+, got B for my PB.

For context, 2nd upper (NS). Joined service since 2007. 32 yrs old.

What job function are you in? Policy, finance, HR, IT etc.

you nail it right. that's very very close to my SB. so for my case, i calculate about $150 for every yr of irrelevant experience. but with that kind of $250 MI even for mid career, i'll forever be lagging behind my peers, not forgetting they will be promoted to higher grade much faster than me, salary gap drifting further and further. so much that i can't swallow... but no choice got to stay a while.

the recent adjustment, none for entry grade grads.

The gap shouldn't get further and further. Most average 2nd upper CEP stays maxed out about $8k, so it's just a matter of you get there faster or slower.

In Civil Service wait long enough you will have it unless your CEP jin high which I suppose will be MX10 for most people.

considered policy. and yes. the $6900+ includes the recent 5% increment.

This means that the default CEP is probably mx11a? For the better cases, mx10?

Are you doing policy research, rather than policy?

What are your working hours like? Do you usually need to stay late / do OT?

i am also a MX11 officer...drawing around 7K. Wonder if i would be promoted to MX11A next year. Otherwise, I would be stuck at the ceiling.

What's your most recent performance rating? How old are you? NS?

Mnd
 

Just got a call from the HR at Ministry of National Development about a knowledge management position I applied for a couple of months ago.

No interview scheduled but just ask why I wanted to leave my current job after less than a year.

I'm quite interested in the job based on the JD.

Anyone know how the working culture at MND is like?

as w all cs, navigating bureaucracy most of e time but a little more so. :)

How old are you? Most likely will get promote la. Unless you really lousy and have a low CEP. it is unlikely your HR will let you max your salary ceiling if you are still young.

What age is considered young?

under 35 when u can still leave the service lol.

I will hit the mx11 ceiling by 35 based on my estimates. Am kind of worried if they don't move me up to mx11a.

Hi guys, can I know what are the diff for div 1, 2, 3, 4.

promotion time
 

Hi guys, just like to find out how long does it take for an Assistant director to be promoted to a deputy director in the civil service, if lets say the dude is an average performer with a good honours.

e.g. diff no. of days of leave, bonus/increment in terms of benefits and diff progression in terms of career.

same same. when were u last promoted?

Hi everyone, I'm working in a MNC now but hoping to join a Ministry or Stat Board.

Besides pay and job scope issues, I don't really fit into the company/department that I'm currently working at. I think because it's an MNC the culture really doesn't suit me. Many of the bosses and colleagues are caucasian and have a very different way of interacting. Even for the locals, many of them are ultra 'ang moh pai' or graduated from overseas unis, so they're more in tune with Western styles of communicating. They expect lots of small talk and socialising even during work and I'm more of a keep to myself kind of person. Not that I don't like socialising but I much prefer to 'segregate' my work time and social time. So I don't mind socialising more during lunch, but not halfway when I'm trying to concentrate on some work. Plus the office is an open office, so it's really obvious that I'm being 'anti-social' when I don't join in their chats etc.

Basically I'm just not on the same wavelength as everyone there, I don't find their jokes funny and have to force myself to laugh/smile...so I think perhaps a more 'conventional' environment like in the public service might suit me better.

What do you guys think? Especially people with exp working in a Ministry or Stat Board, please advise, thank you!

all the salaries you guys quoted here, is it yearly salary (including all bonuses and AWS + allowaces) divided by 12?
coz if its not like that and instead it is monthly salary, a lot of you guys in CS are paid quite high. apart from those in banking finance / O&G, very few can reach your pay at that age

I believe we are all referring to our basic monthly salary. This excludes all the bonuses.

what industry are you working in? what's your job function? what's your age?
usually those who make the switch to Ministry/Stat Board from private sector, are under 35. Older folks may find it more difficult to adjust to the bureacracy and nature of work in Ministry/Stat Board. Potential pay cut for senior folks in private sector too.

If average but boss like, 5-8 yrs? Average only with no backing, then most prob never. AD or MX11 is possible for most. DD or MX10 more challenging (5-7%) of the workforce population.

In the media industry, quite a niche role, so hoping to get out asap to something more employable. I'm 25, with NS. Almost as good as a fresh grad, working exp slightly less than a year.

That's why a lot of people want to move into civil service.

These are some patterns which I observed. Not sure if they are accurate.

Actually pace of promotions will be rather fast in your first 5-10 years in civil service. But pace of promotions will start to slow down in your 30s. A lot depends on CEP.

AD CEP (MX11A)
Default CEP for most people. Worst case plateau at MX11A (plateau at 8.5K) by mid 40s. Not difficult to upgrade to SAD/DD CEP.

SAD/DD CEP (MX10)
Majority will reach MX11A by late 30s and hit MX10 (plateau at 11K) by mid/late 40s. This is easier said than done. You need to not screw up for 20 years to achieve this. Any screw-up goes back to AD CEP.

Director CEP (MX9-level 1)
A few exceptions will reach MX10 by mid-30s (plateau at 11K) then hit MX9 (plateau at 12K) by early or mid-40s

Senior Director CEP (MX9-level 2)
Very very few people make it this far. You must have a string of AO bosses (non-AO bosses harder, usually they will be demolished by AO bosses during ranking unless super senior) who loves you to get here. The problem is AO bosses are very very demanding as well. So far only seen one chap made it. Same as director CEP. but you will cross the MX9 bar in your late 40s and plateau at 16K instead ;)

From my observation, I think there are two or three levels of CEP for MX9.

Let me know if my observations wrong. Help me by affirming/refuting my observations.

Monthly salary.

If one uses annual wage divided by 12, it would be >$10k per month.

That may be so, but salary in banking, finance and O&G, the salary continues to climb way beyond CS scales.

Whereas in CS, salary starts higher than usual to attract quality grads, but then plateaus 10-15 yrs down the road for an average performer, who will then probably retire at the ceiling of his grade. A higher than usual plateau, but still a flat-line.

Unless they are one of those superstars that are lucky enough to be noticed and moved up quickly.

seriously, people in the CS think they are under paid but in fact many in pte sector are worse off.. do you think there is no "plateau" in the pte sector too? at least CS is more or less guaranteed of your high ceiling.....

lol. no guarantee wor. You need to develop very strong mental resilience to survive the idiotic bureaucracy which gets worse over the years. Many, many left after 5-12 years of de-skilling. (You only know how to write papers after a while.) In my opinion, these are brave souls. They may be paid lower. But they are so much happier picking up new skills.

Those who remain are heroes in their own right - you really need a lot of mental strength to repeat almost the same things over and over again, just that for every cycle you went thr, the level of bureaucracy increases.

Quite accurate. Coming from the Poly, we have some similar observation too.

PAX Salary Range (effective 1 Sep 2012)

PAX 2
$10,920 - 14,910 /16,900

PAX 3
$ 7,060 - 9,670 /10,980

PAX 4A/4E
$ 5,120 - 7,690 / 8,980

AD CEP (MX11A) is the equivalent of our PAX 4 (quite close the our ceiling of $8.9). This is where most will end up and retire, as senior lecturer.

SAD/DD CEP (MX10) is the equivalent of our PAX 3 where our ceiling is about $11k. This is where the management staff are placed at usually, from managers (possible to start from Pax 4 too) onwards. At this PAX, there could be AD, DD too.

Some more fortunate DD will move on to PAX 2, equivalent to MX9. Here are the lao jiaos DD, Directors onwards.

Yup, so quite matching.

Your observations are those who realize their CEP. Many have AD or DD CEP but don't move up for various reasons (e.g. openings available, others with same CEP etc). Just cos you have CEP doesn't mean you will reach there.

no doubt CS has its challenges, but my point is how come people in the CS always complain they are underpaid?

for eg, a typical mid career graduate in early 30s in a GLC would struggle to make $90k pa. the money only increases when you get to HOD level, of which there are very few positions.