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I have worked in a school before and the amount of time teachers are trying to navigate all the different systems is crazy. When the P or VP has new project initiatives or research topics, that's on a whole new level already.

So teachers here do not only mould the future, but they also contribute to the ever changing pedagogy.

Moulders
 

Agreed. Teachers play an important role in shaping Curriculum, pedagogy, and assessment.

No it doesn’t automatically.

CEP ultimately has to do with assessed potential by your leaders. It requires time and consistent performance. Doing your Masters perhaps demonstrates your willingness to develop yourself professionally; it does not demonstrate your potential as clearly as actual work done in school.

I heard from some friends that they were selected for the FLP.

How can we get onboard?

I’m a local uni grad, 2nd upper, GEO 3. Taught for about 6 years.

High CEP, consistently high performance grades (regularly getting Bs, occasional A), and still young enough (exact cutoff not known). FLP is centrally managed by HR, so all you can do is wait for the news.

6 years in service and still GEO3 may not suggest a very high CEP though, so you will need to temper your expectations a little. I'm not saying you're definitely not going to be on FLP, but you need to realise that at least amongst the young "go-getters" in the service, it is very competitive.

Nope. CEP cannot be changed easily. It is fixed on your type of education.

For example, if you are a MOE scholar, obviously you would be fast tracked and your RO has to raise a case if he/she wants to drop your grade from A to B every year.

If you are just a farmer aka local uni or NIE without any scholarship, you will get a standard C and then promote slowly. Of course your 1st promotion would be fast, as it is crucial to make you happy at lower pay first.

Your CEP is fixed for life. It CAN change but it wont. You need higher ups to put their necks on the line to request for a change in your CEP. If you are part of management, would you put your neck on the line to change Cep of 1 of your subordinates? For what right? Lol.

This is very misleading. I know many scholars who get Cs. Everyone starts at GEO5 cep.

********. Your CEP is not fixed for life. It could be adjusted upwards if you have proven yourself to be able to perform at a higher level. At the same time, it is possible for a downward adjustment if you really screw up

You can't even tell the difference between performance grade and CEP. RO does not need to raise a case to drop or raise performance grade unless they are giving you adverse grade. Performance grade is dependent on your (duh) performance. Yes, RO needs to justify dropping or raising of CEP. That does not mean it is fixed. I have seen cases of CEP being adjusted. Your RO is not negatively affected when they adjust your CEP but of course, you have to prove your worth and show them that their decision to raise your CEP is a right one.

Stop spreading misinformation. Starting CEP varies according to educational background and scholar status, yes, but CEP can and will be shifted during your performance appraisals after you enter service. Depending on your performance and potential, your CEP can be shifted multiple times early in your career, and then (usually, but not always) stabilise in your mid to late career.

Being a scholar does not automatically guarantee a high CEP, and even if you start high, if you underperform, your panel will have no qualms adjusting your CEP downwards to better reflect your low potential. The same goes for non-scholars who consistently demonstrate that they are deserving to work at higher levels - their CEP can be adjusted to a point where their progression exceeds that of a low-performing scholar.

ems scholarship and above. or pat oyea winner/finalist

When retirement age is reached, can a KP continue on working at his/her position with the same pay and benefits?

someone with 16odd yrs in service. Reality is...does not matter. As lomg as your RO and SLs like you, you can be pushed up very quickly. Big sins can be forgiven. If they do not like you, smallest detail will kill.
Perfect eg....results are nt impt (national exams) if they like you....results are impt if they dont like you. Same for classroom management or anything you can think of. Sad but true

Usually no (re-employment capped at GEO5), but I remember reading something about either CAJT or re-employment options with schools allowed to re-hire at SEO1 pay grade. Not something I really looked into as it's still quite some time away for me 😅 but I think it's worth exploring with your VP/RO, if that's what you'd like to pursue?

Agree 100% Spoken like a true blue veteran.

If you sense your sch leaders and/or RO do not like you, best option is go somewhere else the fastest you can as to stay is only to remain stagnant n torture yourself.

Switching jobs
 

Hi. I have been a teacher for 17 years. Feel like switching to be a school counsellor instead. Any advise? I teach all the NT students so most of the time will he talking to the students and listening to their rants.need to know payscale and also whether will get sch holidays.... anyone can advise pls..

You missed the boat when counsellors first started the seo teachers converted to ne counsellors. My ex CT was pioneer batch.. Now counsellors are under AED scale. Many grumble cos technically they are looked as below EOs. Really your call. If your passion is in counselling go ahead! With these new gen of kids, we do need a lot of counsellors.

Degree holder counsellors are under mx scheme just like any other working in ministries, so definitely won’t lose out to teachers

I wonder how commonly schools do reemployment of KPs, especially when positions for EOs are so limited now...

Update on Pay
 

2012: BT pay. Was earning $4.1k (FCH, non-scholar, male)
2021: just got GEO5. Earning $7.1k.

Changed schools in 2014 and 2017.

I agree with the earlier post. If your SLs like you, major sins can be forgiven. National results are not that important.

But if they don't like you, everything will be picked on (e.g. classroom management, results, etc).

Isn't that common for all jobs? Nothing peculiar to a teaching career.

wow FCH. I only knew few yrs ago you could apply for scholarship AFTER your degree. Friend did that....now very high position change ministries as part of scholar route.

Are you a hod/sh/st now?

Very true. But when you are young and naive, you would think that educators who supposedly teach moral values to students would be above that. Sadly not true. I do feel like a hypocrite sometimes teaching values when we ourselves generally don't practise what we preach.

SH.

Wasn't a scholar (took the old NIE Education degree). If you work hard enough (or harder and / or smarter enough, it is possible. But yes, scholars are deliberately given bigger portfolios to justify their faster promotion. Whether they do it well, though at times they can't lead for nuts and merely get by because farmers tank the project.

I also see some overseas scholars (mostly the PE or Art/Music teachers) who remain as teachers. So yes, being a scholar does not necessarily mean that you get leadership immediately as well.

But at the end of the day, as long as SLs like you, see potential and want to groom you, that seems to be the most impt factor.

Couldn't agree more with all the posts that mentioned this aspect.

I think it's a very big part of why young teachers leave, and why older ones lose their purpose.

Yet many leaders I see are exactly the source of the problem. And hence the issue continues to perpetuates.

We should all do the right thing and stop all the wrongdoings when we see it.
(I know it's easy to say. But hey, one starfish at a time as well.)

simple reason.Many of them (not all of course) got to their position precisely because of this...hence rot starts frm the top...and the top came frm the bottom. hahaha
never ending cycle

Hi, I am ex- moe teacher and recently I went for the interview to rejoin MOE service 2 weeks ago. Till now, my status in career@gov is still “in process”. May I know when will I know the outcome of the interview? From what I see, they are looking for Teachers to start in term 3, but the month of May is starting soon but still no updates.

Adjunct? Usually towards end of may then they will contact because the school will still have staff shifting around etc. Especially for adjuncts who may leave the school, which then makes the demand higher

Not adjunct but back to service

Very hard to be back to service. They have excess teachers. So many schools are merging.. One of the KPI for SLs would be to get rid of dead wood.

just ranting
 

I just want to say.. its nice reading everything on this forum and knowing Im not the only feeling a certain way towards the system.
Dont get me wrong, I love teaching, its very rewarding. In fact seeing the students become what I look forward to the most in any working day (sometimes, not when they piss me off).
But the way the system is.. I believe i dont need to say more right?? Everyone here understands.
My contract ended in april this year, so did my battery (my mental health and motivation to work etc). The endless admin work.. unappreciative parents .. useless meeting .. not to mention millions of other small things (that I cant even think of right now because theres just SO MANY OF THEM).
To be honest. no amount of pay can justify the amount of physical and emotional burden being placed onto teachers. Its really not healthy lah.
Everyday I think of leaving the service, because if the passion is teaching, moe is not the only choice right? Just feeling quite meh, this is how they drive teachers away from the service!

advice
 

hello, everyone! just asking for some career advice.

i am currently a local law undergraduate who has secured a training contract and will be called to bar if i pass my part b bar exam safely. i will probably be getting a second upper. however, i feel like law is not my calling.

i’ve gone through several teaching experiences in my school life, giving tuition, teaching school kids about the law, and teaching underprivileged kids in developing countries on charity trips. i enjoy teaching and wish to enter moe to teach english/GP.

is there any advice to a newbie making a career switch like this into teaching? how does the career compare to law? i hope to achieve a bit more work-life balance and stability in teaching. how were the interviews and pgde in general, in terms of intensity and difficulty? also, is there a glut of teachers right now, much like in law?

thank you in advance!

Trust me, get your bar.

oh yep, I’m definitely going to get called to bar, but I’m just exploring options of going into teaching after getting called, because I don’t really like the idea of legal practice. dread it, almost.

May I know what’s the average pay for female grads with local NUS degree, with second upper class with honours? Thank you

For a more accurate idea, it'll probably be best to seek the opinion of someone who's got experience both with a legal career as well as in teaching. Not sure how many of those visit these forums…

That said, I do think work-life balance in teaching is not that great, especially if you're looking to teach EL/GP - though I guess it depends on how much you are able to detach from work as well. That said, from what I know, work-life balance in many legal jobs isn't great either (from what I've heard, probably worse than teaching).

Don't have personal recent experience with the interview process either, but from various accounts on this forum, it seems pretty selective. There is indeed an over-supply of teachers at the moment, though EL teachers are still pretty in demand.

Most practical path is to complete your legal training so as to maximise your options; but if you have the capacity to juggle it, you could consider registering as a SRE (relief teaching scheme) and stepping into schools to get a better idea of what the job entails. Given that your educational background (just guessing), you might not have that much exposure to the more typical student profile that you're more likely to encounter, given that the majority of vacancies would be in mainstream primary/secondary schools… basically, would suggest you 'try before you buy'.

thank you for this detailed response! ☺️

work-life balance in law is absolutely terrible, i’m prepared to leave the office past midnight as a trainee. but it seems like teaching definitely has a degree of this as well. i’ll keep that in mind!

i definitely will complete my legal training and try my best to stick it out, but i honestly do not think it’s going to be feasible for me to sleep 3 hours a day till i’m thirty. and thank you for that suggestion, too! i’ll apply for relief teaching during my school breaks. this is something that worries me as well, i came from an international school and did ib instead of going down the mainstream education path. i’m quite afraid this might disadvantage me, but i do think EL skills are transferable, no matter the curriculum.

thank you, again!

Yes the language skills are transferable. What could be challenging is build strong teacher-student relationships and understanding the background of students dissimilar to the teacher. While you should be getting more sleep as a teacher, remember that working hours start earlier but don't necessarily end earlier. On CCA days, not unimaginable for a teacher to be in school for 12 hours (6am-6pm) with just a few breaks in between to catch a breather. To be honest, time-for-money wise, the lawyer route probably makes more sense given that you're already halfway there.