seems like many degree holders do grab from what i heard. its a norm. its better to have an income than waiting at home with a degree that collects dust.

the longer you are jobless, the less bargaining power you have in your job finding. i hope the OP understands this fact. all education cert has an expiry date. i have seen degree holders been offered a job that normally gives to a diploma graduate only and the reason is simply that the degree holder has been jobless for too long and HR is not confident of that person is able to perform a job. To make it worse, if you stayed home the rest of the time and not looking or doing something like upgrading yourself, your resume usually lands in the bin. beggars can't be choosers

A degree is not a must to demonstrate value, it obviously is just a cert.
But many mnc like the place I work in (i.e. F100) will place degree holders on management track and diploma on non management track.

There is a clear gap, even if how far you go is still up to your value add

i thought im in a degree vs diploma thread instead lol

more like jobless degree vs jobless diploma

In mnc, you don't have a 'track'. That is for GLC. Because businesses and changes are volatile in MNC. Your KPI last year changes with the global environment. Those who keep up to it gets ahead and there must be opportunities usually vacated by leaving or retiring staffs. Even mgmt trainees get asked to go before they reach their so called promised positions during difficult times or restructuring because there is simply no track. The 'gap' is dependent on value adding and opportunities available not your paper qualifications.

So I'm very sure. You don't work for MNCs.

No track was why I resigned from that mnc job. The promotion track should always be set clearly and promotions for degree holders should always be faster and higher than diploma holders regardless of their value add. So work performance should never be a factor for consideration between a degree holder or diploma holder when promoting. Degree holders should never report to diploma holders. Period.

Certain position degree means nuts. E.g. sales. Who cares if you have a masters but can't sell? I'd take the no degree person who can sell and pay him/her a huge salary anytime. As long as they can bring in the numbers.

Alot of people here still subscribe to the old school of thoughts thinking a degree will give them an advantage in MNC jobs. And then sulk on public forum when they can't get in an MNC. Keep telling themselves they have a degree therefore they should be handed the MMC position. I loled

In reality the degree only gets you into your first job. After that experience counts more than a piece of paper. Connections and network get you places. Not that piece of paper

Problem is no degree is most of the time buay kan.

Yes, they don't understand that the degree is only one of the many elements that push you up. In the MNC reality, track records, reputation, connections, opportunities, EQ, work performance, communication skills, able to get things done, teamwork, problem solver, bring in the revenue on top of the hardskills honed through years of experience all play a part too. These cannot be learned and developed in school. They don't understand that your employment history makes you an alumni in the industry too.

Diploma holder with high EQ, knows the people in the industry and has a good reputation, 10 years of experience in MNCs like Micron with 2 promotions and involvement in major global projects throughout the decade from member to team manager holding lean six sigma black belt, PMP, multiple ISO internal auditor certificates.

vs

degree holder with 10 years of experience in the comfort of a GLC that places its promotion track in place without challenges.

You will see the stark difference during an interview.

The dip holder you describe should be a master deg holder. Dip holder cannot be able to do that.
Dip holder cannot take pmp or six sigmah red belt. Only deg holder can. The ranking system will be there to control so it will not be messy. So you want to big canon also be realistic a bit lah. That's why mnc will not let dip promote faster than deg.

post 22 said it. but people still think a diploma who can get better results can climb higher than deg. crazy. the purpose of a education is to have higher cap. if education no use, might as well hire o level kid who can do better than diploma.

yes, if a dip holder can give better results than deg holder, sure he deserves the promotion. However that dip holder will be told to upgrade to deg otherwise stuck at that rank. maybe old days can la. Now alot rich people invested in education system. i dont think they will allow it to happen like the old days.

Imagine being so insecure that you cry about degree vs diploma and make up a bunch of niche situations that no general degree grad will ever experience.

Hahah quote your source? Which source tells you dip holder cannot take pmp or six sigma? Pmi stated dip holder can, with certain numbers of project hours clocked and SMU prerequisite for even a lean six sigma black belt accept dip holder with just 1 year working experience, definitely all have to meet other requirements.

Prove it. Show us your source that stated "Dip holder cannot take pmp or six sigmah red belt. Only deg holder can."

Trust me, i am from mnc. dip holder cannot take pmp and six sigma red belt. i am now a six sigma already and i am going for my seven sigma course how will i not know? pmp is the project manager certificate also need deg holder. During ranking exercise, we always rank the deg holder higher than the dip holder because deg is higher than dip. Their rank will always stuck there irregardless their performance how good otherwise why all the government sector and government COY structure all the deg holder to take up management rank?

Please tell me you are trolling otherwise you are just a dumbass.
Your language sounds like you are from a GLC trying to pose as a MNC staff without MNC experience.
Nowadays we call them LSS (Lean Six Sigma) we have white, yellow, green, black, master black belt.
No red belts and definitely no 7 sigma LOL!!!
PMP requires 5 years of work experience for diploma holders and 3 for degree due to age and perceived experience. After that you are considered the same. Both of them are not limited to Degree holders. You are subjected to the same exams, same requirements. In MNC, anything goes, your degree don't put you on a 'track' 'course' 'management route' . You are expected to deliver and show results. If you don't, you are out. If you do, you move up when there is a vacancy degree or no degree.

Based on my experience working at a foreign bank for about 5 years, all the SVPs, EDs and above have a degree (after checking them on linkedin), and some at the top usually further their education either by having masters, usually MBA. Don't recall seeing any phd holders.

You can tell yourself that education doesn't define a person's attitude, hardwork etc.. But for MNCs, profit-driven companies, they will usually favor those with at least a degree and they will be 'preferred' over someone with just a diploma.

It is the value. They are preferred because they have connections, relevant experience etc. You don't get to become a vp because you have a degree. It is a whole package. It happens so they are also degree holders, phd or Mba.

Only dumb people believe having a degree means an MNC should hand the promotion to them automatically.

And I’m very sure you have not been part of management programs in top companies, a lot of my peers are senior managers and directors 7-8 years in, 99% of diploma graduates will not get there.

Again I am not saying degree is all that counts if you read my post again, but it is the entry bar and usually a good tell (most non degree holders are less capable)

I'm not the poster you replied to. But I want to point out to you that in an MNC, nobody goes around asking your educational level, management or not. Even HR don't keep track on that. Because it is plain stupid to do that. In Germany and USA, you get a mixture of different education background on leadership positions. But one thing that's sure is that they either have connections, a lot of experience or previous successful track records. You need to have systemic promotions based on paper qualifications in order to be 99% sure no particular paper qualification makes it to that level. And the closest one doing that is a GLC or our local stat board.

So end up is that person who resigned from a Dutch MNC just because a dip holder got promoted over him,a deg holder, plus complained mommy doesn't want to finance his/her daily expenses, got a job? lol.

Yo dude
Don't take this forum seriously. I think u never work in glc some glc people treat mnc as premier league but cannot join so they come to this forum to pretend but the way they type and their thinking always betray them wan...

I think he too malu runaway liao

Wahaha! Dua kang until like that! No 7 sigma lah wahaha! Want to pretend from mnc also lobang broken.

trust me also, I am going for eight sigma, they need PhD qualification so I am trying to study well then I can win those in seven sigma

This is true, diploma holders are usually terrible.

These days having a pulse is all you need to get a degree. No excuse for not having one.

I got degree can win even 100 sigma rainbow belt automatic become manager. Career path is become director. Only diploma report to me i won't report to diploma. I will resign if company want me to report to diploma. :D

I don't have six seven eight sigma but I have six Omega watches can or not?

If I deg and you dip mean cannot. Your omega watch still have to report to me. If company don't agree, i resign because dip must report to deg holder.

He talking about MA program, can read anot.
Nobody say diploma cannot climb but u never see diploma become ib analyst or p&g grad program candidate right

I'm not the poster you replied to. But I want to point out to you that in an MNC, nobody goes around asking your educational level, management or not. Even HR don't keep track on that. Because it is plain stupid to do that. In Germany and USA, you get a mixture of different education background on leadership positions. But one thing that's sure is that they either have connections, a lot of experience or previous successful track records. You need to have systemic promotions based on paper qualifications in order to be 99% sure no particular paper qualification makes it to that level. And the closest one doing that is a GLC or our local stat board.

This is true, the point of a degree is not to get an advantage but to avoid a disadvantage.

In a feel good story there may be some diploma holders who will rise higher than degree holders, but if we compare like for like: a competent diploma holder against a competent degree holder; the degree holder starts with a head start if he is groomed in one of these programs, it’s like running a 100m race and he is starting 50m ahead, how fast do you think you can run?

yup harsh reality. to nreak the cycle, the guy should be a self starter entrepreneur instead

I'm not the poster you replied to. But I want to point out to you that in an MNC, nobody goes around asking your educational level, management or not. Even HR don't keep track on that. Because it is plain stupid to do that. In Germany and USA, you get a mixture of different education background on leadership positions. But one thing that's sure is that they either have connections, a lot of experience or previous successful track records. You need to have systemic promotions based on paper qualifications in order to be 99% sure no particular paper qualification makes it to that level. And the closest one doing that is a GLC or our local stat board.

the point is, commenting in this forum isnt even needed right . lets all go back and earn ourpay

It is always about a systematic promotional system. A diploma should never surpass a degree holder so that the hierarchy is not messed up. That is why we systematically design our ranking to reward base on paper qualification over performance and the so called value. A diploma holder no matter how much faster he can run should never be given the chance to run faster than a degree holder. Resigning because OP was overtook by a diploma holder may sound extreme, but if you look at it closely sounds right. If anyone who outperforms another gets promoted, we will have a higher rank with a mixture of all sorts of qualifications. Like that what is the point of getting a degree?

This debate is pointless, most critical departments in mnc do not even hire diploma holders to start with, maybe you see a diploma holder in it support

I'm not the poster you replied to. But I want to point out to you that in an MNC, nobody goes around asking your educational level, management or not. Even HR don't keep track on that. Because it is plain stupid to do that. In Germany and USA, you get a mixture of different education background on leadership positions. But one thing that's sure is that they either have connections, a lot of experience or previous successful track records. You need to have systemic promotions based on paper qualifications in order to be 99% sure no particular paper qualification makes it to that level. And the closest one doing that is a GLC or our local stat board. In a feel good story there may be some diploma holders who will rise higher than degree holders, but if we compare like for like: a competent diploma holder against a competent degree holder; the degree holder starts with a head start if he is groomed in one of these programs, it’s like running a 100m race and he is starting 50m ahead, how fast do you think you can run? It is always about a systematic promotional system. A diploma should never surpass a degree holder so that the hierarchy is not messed up. That is why we systematically design our ranking to reward base on paper qualification over performance and the so called value. A diploma holder no matter how much faster he can run should never be given the chance to run faster than a degree holder. Resigning because OP was overtook by a diploma holder may sound extreme, but if you look at it closely sounds right. If anyone who outperforms another gets promoted, we will have a higher rank with a mixture of all sorts of qualifications. Like that what is the point of getting a degree?