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Unregistered 17-01-2021 12:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 154060)
Similar to london

oh but what are the rates like trainee. pqe1.pqe2. etc

Unregistered 17-01-2021 02:02 PM

Switching from disputes to corp
 
Hi all, junior disputes assoc in a big 4 firm here – looking to switch into corporate practice (corp finance / M&A etc).

From job postings online, it looks like mid-tier / big firms that do corp work often have fairly strict requirements on hiring only candidates with relevant experience. Does anyone know if it is possible for someone with no corp experience to get into these roles?

Supposing that an offer from a small corp firm comes through, would it make sense to sacrifice (1) salary and (2) the “branding” of a big 4 firm in exchange for exposure to corp work (and then apply for mid-tier / bigger firms at a later stage)?

I am a little bit concerned that the size of the firm will not be looked on favourably with future employers. It may be better to remain in my current role until an offer from a bigger firm comes along – but again, this may be unrealistic (esp. in COVID times) because I lack corp experience. I am also a bit mindful about becoming increasingly entrenched in disputes work if I stay, though I suppose at a junior stage it may not make a huge difference.

Would be very grateful for any views/advice, thanks!

Unregistered 17-01-2021 02:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 154074)
oh but what are the rates like trainee. pqe1.pqe2. etc

If you’re deciding between staying in London and coming back, coming back = less tax.

Unregistered 17-01-2021 04:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 154020)
Recently received an offer for in-house legal counsel position. 7.5k pm with 3-5 months discretionary performance based bonus. 3 pqe.

Am I being lowballed?

What is the company profile, scope of work and your background?
I accept 8.3k but it was a regional role (over 30 jurisdictions in APAC) and i was trained in the specific area the company does business in. This was before covid.

If you're a generalist and its a local role/local company, then no - you're not being low-balled.

If you're a specialist, its a regional or multiple-portfolio role (both legal + compliance), or am MNC, then you have room to nego for more.

I would nego for more, but if they tell me that's the best they can do, i'll accept it in this climate. Definitely would not have accepted pre-covid times.

Unregistered 17-01-2021 09:22 PM

OP's annual package (if the performance bonus is really 5 months) will be 10k a month tho. Haha I thought not bad?

Do you mind sharing how much is your annual package?


Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 154089)
What is the company profile, scope of work and your background?
I accept 8.3k but it was a regional role (over 30 jurisdictions in APAC) and i was trained in the specific area the company does business in. This was before covid.

If you're a generalist and its a local role/local company, then no - you're not being low-balled.

If you're a specialist, its a regional or multiple-portfolio role (both legal + compliance), or am MNC, then you have room to nego for more.

I would nego for more, but if they tell me that's the best they can do, i'll accept it in this climate. Definitely would not have accepted pre-covid times.


Unregistered 18-01-2021 12:30 AM

How does Melbourne Law School fare in SG employer's eyes? Currently a Singaporean who is completing his year 12 in a Victorian High School, and am wondering if I should go to the UK instead.

Thank you all.

Unregistered 18-01-2021 12:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 154103)
How does Melbourne Law School fare in SG employer's eyes? Currently a Singaporean who is completing his year 12 in a Victorian High School, and am wondering if I should go to the UK instead.

Thank you all.

It is very respectable,

No worries in getting a place in international law firms like Baker.

Local Big 4 like Drew even no issue.

Unregistered 18-01-2021 05:41 AM

Saqib Alam was just elected as a partner at Morrison and Foerster in London - very well deserved to him! (ex JLC and AR)

Unregistered 18-01-2021 05:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 154108)
Saqib Alam was just elected as a partner at Morrison and Foerster in London - very well deserved to him! (ex JLC and AR)

Ang Lip Kian also elected in the Singapore office as well - never worked with him before, but it's encouraging that they made up a purely local lawyer as partner (he's an NUS boy - trained at KhattarWong and has worked entirely in Singapore except a short stint in Shanghai)

Unregistered 18-01-2021 08:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 154108)
Saqib Alam was just elected as a partner at Morrison and Foerster in London - very well deserved to him! (ex JLC and AR)

the KCL haters here can stfu now

Tan Ming He 18-01-2021 08:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 154110)
the KCL haters here can stfu now

Degree mill lmao

Unregistered 18-01-2021 09:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 154103)
How does Melbourne Law School fare in SG employer's eyes? Currently a Singaporean who is completing his year 12 in a Victorian High School, and am wondering if I should go to the UK instead.

Thank you all.

Go oxbridge

Unregistered 18-01-2021 12:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 154112)
Go oxbridge

A bit difficult, since I am doing the ATAR (not IB) system. Should have switched earlier if I had known.

Would this be a correct assessment? Oxbridge > LSE/UCL/NUS/SMU > Kings/Melbourne > tier 2 UK > rest of Australia/NZ

Unregistered 18-01-2021 01:18 PM

[QUOTE=Unregistered;154098]OP's annual package (if the performance bonus is really 5 months) will be 10k a month tho. Haha I thought not bad?

Do you mind sharing how much is your annual package?

I did not consider "discretionary bonus". There isn't even a guaranteed 13th month.
The bonus is dependent on many things beyond your control, not just ability or performance. Sometimes it could simply be that someone high up doesn't like your face. You'll never know, you are not entitled to an explanation and you will be disappointed because you expected it to be part of your annual package.

It is better to have a guaranteed base and 13th month.

Unregistered 18-01-2021 01:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 154179)
A bit difficult, since I am doing the ATAR (not IB) system. Should have switched earlier if I had known.

Would this be a correct assessment? Oxbridge > LSE/UCL/NUS/SMU > Kings/Melbourne > tier 2 UK > rest of Australia/NZ

Oxbridge > NUS > LSE/UCL/SMU > Kings/Melbourne > tier 2 UK > rest of Australia/NZ

Unregistered 18-01-2021 03:11 PM

How about suss?

Unregistered 18-01-2021 03:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 154210)
Oxbridge > NUS > LSE/UCL/SMU > Kings/Melbourne > tier 2 UK > rest of Australia/NZ

Oxbridge > NUS/SMU/LSE > UCL > Melbourne/Sydney > Kings > tier 2 UK > rest of Australia/NZ

Those who can make it into NUS/SMU can definitely get into UCL. Typically, employers do not differentiate between NUS/SMU. Both are seen as equal.

Melbourne's curriculum is more rigorous than Kings, just compare the number of FCH. I would put Sydney over Kings too tbh.

Unregistered 18-01-2021 04:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 154239)
Oxbridge > NUS/SMU/LSE > UCL > Melbourne/Sydney > Kings > tier 2 UK > rest of Australia/NZ

Those who can make it into NUS/SMU can definitely get into UCL. Typically, employers do not differentiate between NUS/SMU. Both are seen as equal.

Melbourne's curriculum is more rigorous than Kings, just compare the number of FCH. I would put Sydney over Kings too tbh.

Fake news. AU unis are not rated highly by employers here generally.

Unregistered 18-01-2021 04:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 154258)
Fake news. AU unis are not rated highly by employers here generally.

Is it? Must call police.

Unregistered 18-01-2021 04:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 154258)
Fake news. AU unis are not rated highly by employers here generally.

Sydney law 99.50 ATAR for domestic students. Only top 0.5% of high school leavers can enter.

Sydney law also 3.2 poly GPA. Singapore poly failure can go in. Lol.

Unregistered 18-01-2021 09:14 PM

melbourne is for sure better than Kings lol

Unregistered 18-01-2021 10:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 154286)
melbourne is for sure better than Kings lol

Never mind the trolls. Just last page people were talking about Saqib Alam (King’s alumni) being elected partner at MoFo in London.

I would recommend you pick between UK and Aus depending on whether you might prefer to work in the UK or Aus in addition to Singapore (although not impossible for Aus graduates to get UK training contracts).

Why so sure you have to start training in Singapore?

Unregistered 18-01-2021 11:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 154292)
Never mind the trolls. Just last page people were talking about Saqib Alam (King’s alumni) being elected partner at MoFo in London.

I would recommend you pick between UK and Aus depending on whether you might prefer to work in the UK or Aus in addition to Singapore (although not impossible for Aus graduates to get UK training contracts).

Why so sure you have to start training in Singapore?

only correct answer here. all depends on where you want to work! :)

Unregistered 18-01-2021 11:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 154295)
only correct answer here. all depends on where you want to work! :)

Yup and in the grand scheme working in Aus doesn’t provide you as much portability thereafter compared to London

Unregistered 19-01-2021 12:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 154258)
Fake news. AU unis are not rated highly by employers here generally.

So Kings (50% FCH) is better than Melbourne (10% FCH). Got it.

Unregistered 19-01-2021 12:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 154299)
Yup and in the grand scheme working in Aus doesn’t provide you as much portability thereafter compared to London

agree. England is a much larger economic entity, and English law is the preferred governing law for many agreements (just as with English jurisdiction). Even the top Australian firms all kena merged with English firms.

this reminds me of how meaningless the NUS v KCL debate here is.

Unregistered 19-01-2021 07:40 PM

Hi Seniors, could i ask whether a CAP of 4.0 in NUS qualify you for the top 50%? If fact, what percentile would a student with such a CAP be?

I ask this because there are certain requirements that i have to meet. Thanks in advance!

Unregistered 20-01-2021 01:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 154441)
Hi Seniors, could i ask whether a CAP of 4.0 in NUS qualify you for the top 50%? If fact, what percentile would a student with such a CAP be?

I ask this because there are certain requirements that i have to meet. Thanks in advance!

4.0 is way above the threshold for top 50%. Don't worry. You would probably be around the 75th percentile

Unregistered 21-01-2021 09:50 AM

Any reviews on KCL LLM in international financial law?

Unregistered 21-01-2021 10:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 154635)
Any reviews on KCL LLM in international financial law?

Did an LLM with Kings, but not in international financial law. I figure some of the modules overlap though.

The content of the mods weren't difficult. As long as you've been a law student before, the content is actually quite easy, certainly easier than undergrad imo.

My issue was actually class participation (graded), practice essays (ungraded) and the tutorials (over adobe's version of zoom) (ungraded). It's A LOT of time and effort from my day. I would not do it over.

I also did not enjoy my interactions with the profs. Some were stellar and some were just cmi. It was luck of the draw.

School fees were payable on module which was great cause then i could pay it off with my salary and i didnt need to take on any additional financial obligations.

I completed the course in just under 2 years.

Unregistered 21-01-2021 03:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 149809)
I've been asked to write something about the Lee Suet Fern case, so I've done a quick summary of the judgment, and added my brief views on the matter. This is a politically explosive matter concerning high profile people in my industry, so don't expect any spicy takes from me! (Not publicly on Facebook at least.)

LACK OF DILIGENCE
At [149](a)-(b): LSF had made material representations to LKY in the execution process that she had no basis to make, which is, at best, irresponsible. Namely, she told him that the version of the Will he was signing was identical to the one he executed several versions ago (ie this was simply a reversion to a Will he had executed previously). In reliance of this, LKY then went ahead to sign the Will. As it turns out, there actually existed several material differences from the version he previously signed. Crucially, LSF had not seen the executed previous version, so she was in no position to assure him that it was the same. As such, she failed to ascertain that the Will truly reflected the testator's (LKY's) intentions, which is a cardinal sin for Will drafting.

CONFLICT OF INTEREST
[149](c)-(d), (h): By playing such a central role in the execution of LKY's last Will while being the wife of a major beneficiary as set out above, LSF was in a position of conflict of interest as a lawyer. As such, she should have advised LKY to seek independent legal advice. She did not. Had she been in a solicitor-client relationship, this would have been a grave breach. Nonetheless, she had divided loyalties, being married to LHY, a beneficiary, and also servicing LKY as she would a client.

OTHER QUESTIONABLE ACTIONS
[149](e)-(g): LSF allowed LKY to execute the Will despite knowledge of the above, and left KKL out of most of the material correspondence. She then failed to fully inform her what happened even after the fact. She did not clarify with LKY who drafted the last Will, and if it was indeed identical to an earlier Will he had executed.

The court also found that she had been less than honest in trying to minimise her involvement to the court, although they also found that she did not act dishonestly in getting the Will executed.

WHY NOT STRUCK OFF?
LSF got off lightly, all things considered, because she was found not to be in a lawyer-client relationship with LKY. As such, her transgressions were only poor form for a lawyer, but did not breach the lawyer-client relationship, which is far more serious. All lawyers owe duties to their clients, and failure to advance one's client's best interests, acting in conflict of interest are serious breaches of a lawyer's duties.

Whether there exists a lawyer-client relationship will depend on the facts. Even if no contract was signed, if BOTH parties understood there to be one and acted in that manner, such a relationship can arise (judgment at [61]).

In this case, the court found that a lawyer-client relationship did not exist (judgment at [133]) because while LSF viewed herself as acting as LKY's lawyer (judgment at [127]), LKY did not view LSF as being his lawyer (judgment at [130]), as he thought Kwa had a hand in drafting the final Will.

MY VIEWS
This is a very ugly and public spat. I hope it's over.

As a lawyer, it should have been clear to LSF that the situation was one where she was in a position of conflict. As such, she ought to have gone out of her way to ensure that there wasn't even the slightest appearance of impropriety. She could have safeguarded herself by waiting for KKL to get get back, and/or at least keeping KKL copied in ALL correspondence. Whether inadvertently (LHY was the first to omit KKL from the chain, if she hit "reply all" thereafter, she may not have realised KKL was no longer looped in) or otherwise, she did not.

While the speed with which the Will was signed may well have been on LKY's instructions, again, given how sensitive this all was, every effort should have been made to keep KKL or her staff in the loop to avoid future allegations of impropriety.

Personally, though, I think the final Will, with the demolition clause reinstated, is more consistent with the public stance LKY has had regarding his house all these years.

I am grateful that 38 Oxley will not be demolished, because I feel it is a part of our national heritage. But LKY of all people should have known that the demolition clause cannot override the State: he pushed through reforms in land law that gave the State ultimate power over property here. Many property owners have been displaced over the years, sometimes with inadequate compensation, to make way for development. But would we have had such progress if proprietary rights were recognised? The URA would've spent years litigating against stubborn landowners, or a fortune to buy them out. If PM Lee or the government of the day were so minded, an act of Parliament could have been passed to preserve 38 Oxley, notwithstanding what the Will said.

Still, I think this whole matter is actually a proxy fight, and the underlying issues remain unaddressed. This kind of family thing often no right no wrong one, and those of us who are not privy to what's going on can only speculate.

But hopefully this brings the whole unhappy episode to a close. I think the public is getting quite tired of seeing the Lee family dirty laundry being aired in public, and expensive legal cases being brought to settle private family affairs.


SL of LVM


Are you the joker who just joined my firm?

Unregistered 21-01-2021 03:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 154637)
Did an LLM with Kings, but not in international financial law. I figure some of the modules overlap though.

The content of the mods weren't difficult. As long as you've been a law student before, the content is actually quite easy, certainly easier than undergrad imo.

My issue was actually class participation (graded), practice essays (ungraded) and the tutorials (over adobe's version of zoom) (ungraded). It's A LOT of time and effort from my day. I would not do it over.

I also did not enjoy my interactions with the profs. Some were stellar and some were just cmi. It was luck of the draw.

School fees were payable on module which was great cause then i could pay it off with my salary and i didnt need to take on any additional financial obligations.

I completed the course in just under 2 years.

What’s the benefit of the LLM? Or did you just have too much money and time?

Unregistered 21-01-2021 09:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 154709)
Are you the joker who just joined my firm?

SL of LVM la

Unregistered 21-01-2021 09:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 154303)
agree. England is a much larger economic entity, and English law is the preferred governing law for many agreements (just as with English jurisdiction). Even the top Australian firms all kena merged with English firms.

this reminds me of how meaningless the NUS v KCL debate here is.

Just debating with myself about moving to New York v London - USA domestic law is of course incredibly lucrative (more than any other type of law in the world), but 1) unlike English law which is transferrable in M&A, Construction, Projects, etc. it's only really transferrable for Capital Markets and some types of banking and 2) NY hours are just brutal.

Unregistered 22-01-2021 10:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 154712)
What’s the benefit of the LLM? Or did you just have too much money and time?

It was useful in getting me in-house offers.
Absolutely useless in practice.

Unregistered 22-01-2021 12:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 154881)
It was useful in getting me in-house offers.
Absolutely useless in practice.

You mean before LLM you were unsuccessful in landing inhouse roles because you didn’t hold post graduate education?

Unregistered 22-01-2021 12:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 154909)
You mean before LLM you were unsuccessful in landing inhouse roles because you didn’t hold post graduate education?

No. I was already in-house with a F500 in a regional role.

The problem is moving up. I started out my in-house career with a German company, and everyone in the legal and compliance department (at HQ) had at least a masters. Many of them had PhDs.

I thereafter left the German company and was offered a position with a US company which stated in their jd that post-grad degree was preferable. I did not take up this offer.

Instead, I joined a European JV and in the welcome email sent to global legal colleagues introducing me, head office wrote: xx graduated from King's College, London with an LLM in xxxx".

Unregistered 23-01-2021 12:49 PM

Kings grads flooding these forums lmao. So sad.

The reality is Melbourne/Sydney/UNSW are all above Kings. Both in terms of cohort and curriculum.

Unregistered 23-01-2021 01:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 154985)
Kings grads flooding these forums lmao. So sad.

The reality is Melbourne/Sydney/UNSW are all above Kings. Both in terms of cohort and curriculum.

Lol, slip a shrimp on the barbie and dream on then mate

Unregistered 23-01-2021 08:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 154987)
Lol, slip a shrimp on the barbie and dream on then mate

KCL LLB grad detected

Your alma mater is a degree mill


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