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18-09-2017 11:40 AM
fobbie
Quote:
Originally Posted by Unregistered View Post
How's the job market for patent agents in singapore? I know that the qualification exams are a barrier, but are there that many positions? Only a few pure IP firms locally like Marks & Clerk, and Spruson. Is it easy to get a job there?

Also do they look at how well you did for your undergrad degree?
glad that there is some interest in these threads. I am a current trainee, finished my GCIP and still getting to know the daily work. I have to say, the job market is not that good because there are not many positions open. you see, for training, you need to be under a registered and qualified patent attorney. there are not that many to begin with. hope top scientists and engineers can consider this path but have to reduce pay at entry for few years. the Government has been pushing for innovation and with it, should come IP I think. As there are so few positions at companies, they probably filter the degrees. Some go for PHDs. From what I see, PHDs can have a hard time changing their mindsets in this job. Like some posters said, to do well, you need to like reading and writing a lot. And as a trainee, to take a lot of c**p also.

For number of places, like you say, there are only a few boutique IP firms locally. These are not legal firms, just pte ltd. The market has opened up alot because now there are law firms with patent departments with registered patent attorneys. from what I hear, you can get to be paid slightly better in law firms if you have proven your worth, or get registered. their IP departments are buffered by bigger departments like litigation. maybe best to get trained and cut your teeth in a boutique IP firm, then try to engineer a move to elsewhere. From what I observe in my company, only a handful get to shine or be recognised. Many others just work under the radar. I think it depends on what you want. For myself, it should be interesting to change firm once I get registered and not get too comfortable.
16-09-2017 11:28 PM
Unregistered How's the job market for patent agents in singapore? I know that the qualification exams are a barrier, but are there that many positions? Only a few pure IP firms locally like Marks & Clerk, and Spruson. Is it easy to get a job there?

Also do they look at how well you did for your undergrad degree?
15-09-2017 12:52 PM
Unregistered
patent attorney trainee

Quote:
Originally Posted by Unregistered View Post
As others have mentioned there are two options:
1. work in a patent attorney firm
2. work in a law firm

In a law firm you cannot be a partner unless you are a practicing lawyer.

In a patent attorney firm you can be a partner if you qualify as a patent agent in Singapore. This is not an unreasonable objective, but it will take 10-15 years of hard work to get there.

Singapore pay ranges are:
[url=://.patentattorneyjobboard.com/page/salary_survey.html]Salary Survey | Patent Attorney Job Board[/

So you do not have to be a partner to make the kind of money you want, and it is feasible to do in the time scale you mention, if
a) you manage to pass all the exams very quickly
b) you generate a lot of revenue

GCIP is relatively easy - it is a university law course. The passing rates for the qualifying exams is much lower, typically 0-30% for paper A and C (The people that are sitting these exams typically have masters and PhDs that have never failed an exam in their life).

Check out IP career day at MBS on Thursday if you are still interested
[url=://.ipos.gov.sg/ipweek/programme/career-forum/]IP Career Forum | IP [email protected][/
just visited this thread. things have changed so much since the thread was last active. nowadays you can find a handful of patent attorneys who have become partners at law firms. needless to say, these are probably the very top cream of the crop. I had worked with some patent attorneys or agents in my R&D work and can say that the quality can vary by so much! there are some that can be so bad and it's no surprise given their years of working in the industry, they still won't move beyond associate or senior associate level. I think you can make very big bucks if you do manage to shine among the registered people. from what I gathered during my time as a trainee, a newly registered agent can expect 6 to 8k salary, entry level and depending on firm and capability. thereafter, they say the sky is the limit. I hearsay one partner can make 200-350k per annum if really good, plus profit sharing.

coming back to trainees, I tried my hands at being a trainee. passed the GCIP but kept getting stuck at the qualifying examinations. true, the papers are quite entry level as compared to actual daily work but still, the pass rates are low. it does take a lot of mentoring, training and fair bit of luck to pass these papers! anyway, I have since dropped out and stopped trying.

It's a slog of a job plus studying like some posters have mentioned and the choice of a firm to work at can be important. I was at an Australian firm and the culture was a shock to me, coming from research. don't ever think that you will be given your own sweet time to digest things and advise clients etc. it is a numbers thing and you have to meet billing targets every single month. you are expected to be a business unit and keep generating invoices for the firm. if you are not able to do that, it can be bye bye for you, and appraisals are based on that. the structure can be like a pyramid if you look at it.

and when you think it's fair game to just keep billing, imagine the odds further stacked against you when massive discounts are given to clients you handle, and certain billing items are not under you. plus, there are so-called seniors who will also take a cut of your billing, using the pyramid. it all made for a very bad and sour taste. for would-be trainees, it may be better to ask around and join a firm that can properly train and nurture you. personally, i would prefer joining one that wasn't so harsh on billing but that's the reality i guess. there are many places that treat you like an invoice generating machine only and it actually serves them better if you never get registered if you think about it, like a poster mentioned. it's like a glass ceiling 'cos they won't give you registered pay. so, don't keep thinking of salary first until you at least get yourself registered. even then, you need to find ways to add value until you are justified to get further promotions and maybe can buy in.

just my 5 cents from my few years stuck as a trainee, now happier doing other things outside of research, technical stuff and getting screamed at almost daily. earn an average salary but so much happier.
26-08-2013 02:28 PM
Unregistered
IP career forum at MBS

As others have mentioned there are two options:
1. work in a patent attorney firm
2. work in a law firm

In a law firm you cannot be a partner unless you are a practicing lawyer.

In a patent attorney firm you can be a partner if you qualify as a patent agent in Singapore. This is not an unreasonable objective, but it will take 10-15 years of hard work to get there.

Singapore pay ranges are:
Salary Survey | Patent Attorney Job Board

So you do not have to be a partner to make the kind of money you want, and it is feasible to do in the time scale you mention, if
a) you manage to pass all the exams very quickly
b) you generate a lot of revenue

GCIP is relatively easy - it is a university law course. The passing rates for the qualifying exams is much lower, typically 0-30% for paper A and C (The people that are sitting these exams typically have masters and PhDs that have never failed an exam in their life).

Check out IP career day at MBS on Thursday if you are still interested
IP Career Forum | IP [email protected]
12-07-2013 12:47 AM
Unregistered Why anyone would want to be a patent agent in Singapore is beyond me. Relatively speaking, our market and the volume of commercial R&D work conducted here is insignificant compared to other developed countries. Is there even a sustainable market for patent filing/ prosecution here? I hope nobody is getting their patent agent aspirations from the government's charade of the country becoming an "IP hub". Any "hub" plans the government has will eventually flop, with the most recent being the motorsports "hub".
04-07-2013 11:52 AM
Unregistered Hi there,

Sad to say, 3 years will (to clear all papers) appear to be a tad too optimistic - I'd say the average is about 5 years or so.

Aside looking at the past rates published, you may want to have a look at a sample exam paper (try looking at papers from 2010 onwards. They should be more indicative of the examination standards these days). Granted, it may be too early for you to look at the exam papers, but it should give you an idea of what kind of "readings" you are expected to do (as at least one person has already pointed out, you do need to read and write a lot!).

In any case, the exam papers can be considered "entry level" already since in "real life," the practice is quite different. For example, for paper "A" you have the inventor feeding you with information - you just need to draft the claims to the invention. In real practice, the inventor will probably give you a "two liner" or a picture and expect you to draft a 10~20 page (or more) specification.

Just sharing this information so that you can manage your expectations a little (as least you won't be caught mentally unprepared when you do join this profession).

As for the salary, don't expect too much until you become qualified - go for a few interviews (you'd need to anyway for the internship, if you plan to join this profession) and you'd probably get a better picture.

Everything said, there'd always be aberrations (no. of years to pass, salary etc.). You'd need the determination to follow through and be mentally prepared for the long haul.

All the best dude!
23-05-2013 05:00 PM
Unregistered
patent agent

You can try this line if you are able to write well and is technically strong. Other than that, you got to love reading.....not story books but journal papers, articles and patent specification.

the timeline you are targeting is very challenging. Infact, I only know one person that is able to achieve that (passing the qualifying exam) in 3 years. Initial years when the system just started out, its easier. Right now, its tough. Go and take a look at the passing rate (in IPOS website) of the exam and you will know why.

Alot of patent agents have Masters or Phds (not uncommon). Other than that, they are also chartered UK or Europe attorney (more exams). Yet these people are still not partners. To be one at 30 is a tall order
26-02-2013 09:58 AM
aspenx
Quote:
Originally Posted by Unregistered View Post
Your written English is too sloppy and poorly constructed for you to consider a job as a patent engineer.

It is also a shite job that will work you to the bone and the pay isn't that fantastic for the first few years.
As sloppy as my English is, your reading comprehension isn't any better.
26-02-2013 07:46 AM
Unregistered
Quote:
Originally Posted by aspenx View Post
As mentioned, I am targeting 3 years. It IS doable. If you squeeze everything together and do well, theoretically it can be done in 1~1.5 years as IPOS does not limit the sequence etc of fulfilling the requirements. However the intensity and all the unknowns right now are very daunting to me. Looking for people who have walked this path to share their experiences. I have only heard from 2 so far (somewhat).
Your written English is too sloppy and poorly constructed for you to consider a job as a patent engineer.

It is also a shite job that will work you to the bone and the pay isn't that fantastic for the first few years.
26-02-2013 07:33 AM
aspenx I hope to clear the course, the 4 QE and internship in 3years max and become a Singapore registered patent attorney (not lawyer) with ~6k basic salary a month. Possible? Don't mind doing the internship for the whole 3years if it will help to achieve this with more certainty.
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