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Today 02:42 PM

Unregistered

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered

I agree with this guy. You know the work that international firms do? The clients they serve?
Totally different. The thought leadership in international firm is on a whole new level.
I’m speaking from experience. Will domestic client pay you in US$? No.
Can local firms increase billing rates? No. People will just find a cheaper alternative.

Am on the client side. I totally agree. I've been to so many of these law firm client events, talks or seminars.

The international firms really outshine the local firms in terms of marketing, ability to showcase their capabilities, and client attention. SOmething that the local lawyers have yet to wise up to - it's not simply the technical ability (that's expected from all external counsel) but the client servicing that's equally impt.

Let's face facts - you put an angmor lawyer and an asian lawyer in front of an audience, repeating the same content word-for-word, and the angmor lawyer will always appear to have more gravitas (to both the angmor and asian audience). That's the way of the world, esp in this part of the world.

All the local Big 4 lawyers are pretty much fungible apart frm a few specific market-leading teams in certain Big 4s. Local firms honestly need to up their game to be up to scratch with the internationals.

Today 12:30 PM

Unregistered

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered

Oh sweet summer child…

Big4 ain’t stressful compared to the stress at the international firm level. Honestly the playing field is so different. But ti answer your first question, some lawyers (i) are so good that they don’t feel too much stress doing the work, (ii) manage stress better, (iii) have coping mechanisms, or (iv) any combination of (i) to (iii).

To answer your second question, local firms can’t increase their salary because they can’t increase their billing rate. And they can’t increase their billing rate because they can’t demonstrate more value-add than they’re worth. International firms can charge more because their clients value their services more (e.g. commercial acumen, foreign law expertise) that many local lawyers don’t demonstrate. Also, SG clients tend to be cheap AF. Again, different playing field.

Today 08:03 AM

Unregistered

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered

Why need to earn so much? Issnt mental health more important? Already Big 4 so stressful , I can only imagine intl firms is worse?

And why local firms don't increase salary to match intl firms?

Today 12:48 AM

Unregistered

Unhappy lawyers: what is stopping you from changing careers?

I'm in a similar position myself - I'm a lawyer and I want to change careers but I'm not sure what I want to do.

Can I ask what the reasons are for people wanting to leave but not choosing to?

Yesterday 06:30 PM

Unregistered

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered

How can a SA be making so much? $60k a mth? or you mean a year

That’s more than half a million a year.

Impossible for the SA to bill so much imo.

Also no clients will pay so much.

OK, I think S$600k is possible, but as always, needs context.

The Cravath scale ends at 8 PQE, at which assocs can expect US$415k + USD$115k in bonuses. So in theory an 8 PQE can make US$530k (or S$730k total).

But there are massive caveats:
-Not all US firms match the Cravath scale (especially bonuses)
-SG offices of US firms may pay a lower rate than their US HQ for various reasons (e.g. if the SG office is simply much less profitable)
-SG offices of US firms often cut PQE for Singapore laterals (this can be significant)

And then there is always the overhanging risk of you getting too senior (and expensive), and being shown the door if you cannot justify the high salary, of if it's simply more economical for the firm to hire a much cheaper junior to replace you. US firms are quite notorious for this, and especially with respect to their overseas offices. But yeah, you'll be massively well paid while it lasts.

Yesterday 04:57 PM

Unregistered

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered

You know how much an 8+ year SA in white shoe makes?
Versus big 4 partner at 5-6 Pqe?

4-8x more gross all in

12,000 versus 60,000 per month.

Why need to earn so much? Issnt mental health more important? Already Big 4 so stressful , I can only imagine intl firms is worse?

And why local firms don't increase salary to match intl firms?

Yesterday 04:56 PM

Unregistered

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered

Lol frog in the well spotted. Go ask your peers working in international firms la, or a recruiter.

Even around half decade ago, even non-White shoe mid tier int'l firms like Norton Rose, Hogan Lovells were alr offering around $25-27K per month for ~6-7PQE senior assocs. Not keeping track since I went inhouse.

I can only imagine the numbers hv risen in the intervening years given the latest rounds of salary wars. And unlike our esteemed "prestigious" local firms doing "wAlL sTrEeT wOrK" like TSMP, Rodyk, R&T, international firms rarely if ever slash salaries during downturns (they simply fire assocs wholesale).

There's a reason why people here are obsessed international firms like they're the holy grail of pvt practice roles. Compared to the comp you can get as a junior partner in a local Big 4, the pay gulf is very real.,

Good, proceed,

Yesterday 04:23 PM

Unregistered

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered

How can a SA be making so much? $60k a mth? or you mean a year

That’s more than half a million a year.

Impossible for the SA to bill so much imo.

Also no clients will pay so much.

Yesterday 01:20 PM

Unregistered

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered

How can a SA be making so much? $60k a mth? or you mean a year

That’s more than half a million a year.

Impossible for the SA to bill so much imo.

Also no clients will pay so much.

On one end complain local firms paying peanuts for how much they work you. On the other keep on gaslighting yourself saying there’s no way an SA or JP can be paid so much. sinkie mindset really cmi

Yesterday 11:33 AM

Unregistered

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered

How can a SA be making so much? $60k a mth? or you mean a year

That’s more than half a million a year.

Impossible for the SA to bill so much imo.

Also no clients will pay so much.

Lol don't be ignorant. An SA's hourly rate in a white shoe US firm is around 900 USD. Assuming they bill 2000 hours a year (the typical billing target for a white shoe firm), with a typical 85% realization rate, they are bringing in over USD 1.5 million a year. Paying them SGD 600k is peanuts next to what they are making for the firm.

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