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  #6241 (permalink)  
Old 15-06-2020, 03:01 AM
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what a waste of bandwidth with people still talking about FCH and law school names

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  #6242 (permalink)  
Old 15-06-2020, 03:40 AM
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Nah a lawyer billing 2000 hours will not have time to differentiate honours classes across schools. Its like in law school, do you really care which schoolís IP system is more rigorous?

An FCH or high 2:1 and CV gets you to the interview. Thatís it.
You'll be surprised how many people can do 2000 billable hours and still make time for other things. Unless you're crying/dying

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  #6243 (permalink)  
Old 15-06-2020, 03:41 AM
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what a waste of bandwidth with people still talking about FCH and law school names
What a waste of money to go to a degree mill

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  #6244 (permalink)  
Old 15-06-2020, 04:20 AM
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The sobering reality is that many fch at the internationals (the true internationals - if youíre in that league you automatically know what it means), wonít survive more than 2 years max.
These firms hire in troves but itís a revolving door.
The people who leave (or has to leave) has nothing to do with capability, it has more to do with global hr numbers and resource allocation (things you donít see unless you are at the EXCO level.

Anyway, just know that in 2 years time you may not even be in law.
Itís a revolving door.
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  #6245 (permalink)  
Old 15-06-2020, 04:24 AM
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The sobering reality is that many fch at the internationals (the true internationals - if youíre in that league you automatically know what it means), wonít survive more than 2 years max.
These firms hire in troves but itís a revolving door.
The people who leave (or has to leave) has nothing to do with capability, it has more to do with global hr numbers and resource allocation (things you donít see unless you are at the EXCO level.

Anyway, just know that in 2 years time you may not even be in law.
Itís a revolving door.
Thx good to know. Does my FLA count
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  #6246 (permalink)  
Old 15-06-2020, 04:28 AM
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Thx good to know. Does my FLA count
Itís very easy to gauge whether one is in a true international.
At 2pqe (Sg scale) you should be getting SGD10,500 gross and above.

Anyway, no point criticizing the fch.
Truth of the matter is that increasingly itís going to be difficult for 2:2 to find a job.
Thereís so many fch.


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  #6247 (permalink)  
Old 15-06-2020, 05:40 AM
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Itís very easy to gauge whether one is in a true international.
At 2pqe (Sg scale) you should be getting SGD10,500 gross and above.

Anyway, no point criticizing the fch.
Truth of the matter is that increasingly itís going to be difficult for 2:2 to find a job.
Thereís so many fch.
Lol what. No one is criticising the FCH from reputable places
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  #6248 (permalink)  
Old 15-06-2020, 10:17 AM
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And RHT. 2 SCs one former well-respected JA. TRC, SLB. Problem with all you recent grads is you only hear about Big 4. There are excellent firms out there that should put you in good stead
I can confirm SLB is good. Former SLB Edmund Eng is now running his own outfit at Fullerton Chambers, he has a good pipeline of work if you're into disputes.

For FLA, K&L Gates Straits is also good. Did a matter opposite them. Was impressed by their work.

Advocatus is also another good local small/mid firm, if you're into disputes.
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  #6249 (permalink)  
Old 15-06-2020, 10:41 AM
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A UK FCH is a dime a dozen nowadays, and as a trainee, don't expect to start on the UK scale.

The pecking order of firms in terms of pay for a junior is something like this:

1. US White Shoe Firms (eg Milbank, MoFo, LW, W&C) - these pay over 20k per month but only usually start taking in juniors at 2 PQE and beyond (SG scale)
2. Other US firms (e.g. Dechert) - less than White Shoe Firms but more than Magic/Silver Circle firms (not confirmed)
3. UK Magic or Silver Circle firms (e.g. CC, Links, HSF, A&O, Ashurst, Hogan Lowells - note, L&L side not counted) - these pay around 12-13k per month for 2 PQE (SG scale)
4. BMWL, NRF, Clyde - these pay around 8-10k for 2PQE (not sure about Ascendant though)
5. Big 4 - these pay about 7-8k for 2PQE
6. Firms like WKW, Dentons, TSMP, and other boutiques (e.g. Blackoak or the accounting-linked law firms) pay similar or slightly less than Big 4. These also include some JVs like MPillay and Morgan Lewis).
7. Then you have everyone else. Some of the JVs also fall in this tier like EHE or DMS.

Most of the JVs are scams, the only obviously integrated ones (i.e. where you aren't on local payscale and the place functions as one firm) are BMWL, Clyde, CC (not sure about about the smaller ones though).

TC wise, above the Big 4 only CC & BMWL offer TCs. Although A&O has a UK-linked TC and Ascendant is now offering TCs on behalf of NRF - don't know how integrated they are to NRF though. So if you wanna start as a trainee in Singapore and want to go "above" Big 4, you only have very few choices.
Thanks for taking the time to post this. It's well thought out and from what I can see mostly accurate
For all the juniors/ trainees out there, if you're wondering if you're working for an "international" firm or a pseudo international, as a rule of thumb unless the partner is white, an expat or a local who was previously working in the London office etc. before moving back to SG, it's likely a "scam" JV.

To be on the "international" side, you generally would be advising on English or NY law. The law firms you'd be working against would be other international law firms, often from non-SG offices. Fees will also be charged in USD (which is why the Assocs there can justify their high salaries, as they bill in USD but get paid in SGD).
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  #6250 (permalink)  
Old 15-06-2020, 10:48 AM
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I can confirm SLB is good. Former SLB Edmund Eng is now running his own outfit at Fullerton Chambers, he has a good pipeline of work if you're into disputes.

For FLA, K&L Gates Straits is also good. Did a matter opposite them. Was impressed by their work.

Advocatus is also another good local small/mid firm, if you're into disputes.
Heard Straits didn't retain anyone and imposed a pay cut.
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