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  #17451 (permalink)  
Old 10-08-2022, 08:03 AM
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Why need to earn so much? Issnt mental health more important? Already Big 4 so stressful , I can only imagine intl firms is worse?

And why local firms don't increase salary to match intl firms?
Oh sweet summer childÖ

Big4 ainít stressful compared to the stress at the international firm level. Honestly the playing field is so different. But ti answer your first question, some lawyers (i) are so good that they donít feel too much stress doing the work, (ii) manage stress better, (iii) have coping mechanisms, or (iv) any combination of (i) to (iii).

To answer your second question, local firms canít increase their salary because they canít increase their billing rate. And they canít increase their billing rate because they canít demonstrate more value-add than theyíre worth. International firms can charge more because their clients value their services more (e.g. commercial acumen, foreign law expertise) that many local lawyers donít demonstrate. Also, SG clients tend to be cheap AF. Again, different playing field.



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  #17452 (permalink)  
Old 10-08-2022, 12:30 PM
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Oh sweet summer childÖ

Big4 ainít stressful compared to the stress at the international firm level. Honestly the playing field is so different. But ti answer your first question, some lawyers (i) are so good that they donít feel too much stress doing the work, (ii) manage stress better, (iii) have coping mechanisms, or (iv) any combination of (i) to (iii).

To answer your second question, local firms canít increase their salary because they canít increase their billing rate. And they canít increase their billing rate because they canít demonstrate more value-add than theyíre worth. International firms can charge more because their clients value their services more (e.g. commercial acumen, foreign law expertise) that many local lawyers donít demonstrate. Also, SG clients tend to be cheap AF. Again, different playing field.
I agree with this guy. You know the work that international firms do? The clients they serve?
Totally different. The thought leadership in international firm is on a whole new level.
Iím speaking from experience. Will domestic client pay you in US$? No.
Can local firms increase billing rates? No. People will just find a cheaper alternative.

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  #17453 (permalink)  
Old 10-08-2022, 02:42 PM
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I agree with this guy. You know the work that international firms do? The clients they serve?
Totally different. The thought leadership in international firm is on a whole new level.
Iím speaking from experience. Will domestic client pay you in US$? No.
Can local firms increase billing rates? No. People will just find a cheaper alternative.
Am on the client side. I totally agree. I've been to so many of these law firm client events, talks or seminars.

The international firms really outshine the local firms in terms of marketing, ability to showcase their capabilities, and client attention. SOmething that the local lawyers have yet to wise up to - it's not simply the technical ability (that's expected from all external counsel) but the client servicing that's equally impt.

Let's face facts - you put an angmor lawyer and an asian lawyer in front of an audience, repeating the same content word-for-word, and the angmor lawyer will always appear to have more gravitas (to both the angmor and asian audience). That's the way of the world, esp in this part of the world.

All the local Big 4 lawyers are pretty much fungible apart frm a few specific market-leading teams in certain Big 4s. Local firms honestly need to up their game to be up to scratch with the internationals.

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  #17454 (permalink)  
Old 10-08-2022, 07:57 PM
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so are people in big 4 all aiming to go international firms ?

And what about inhouse counsel roles? are they for less capable lawyers?
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  #17455 (permalink)  
Old 10-08-2022, 10:11 PM
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so are people in big 4 all aiming to go international firms ?

And what about inhouse counsel roles? are they for less capable lawyers?
Iíd say a lot of young lawyers in big 4 firms are itching to prove themselves in international firms. More glory, more pay, but also more stress. Not that itís not lucrative or sexy to have a long career in a big4 firm (some people really like it), but like OP said itís a different playing field and different market.

For in-house roles, it really depends. There are in-house roles, and there are in-house roles. If you hop to a large legal team in an established institution (e.g. banks), you can basically coast. Pay is not fantastic, but hours are good and work tends to be repetitive. The legal team is more or less a cost centre, just to tick the boxes. There are other in-house roles in smaller teams where the counsel manages legal affairs and general execution aspects of the business. Almost doubles up as the COO and actually has a say in the overall business. These roles are demanding, but someone who can perform at this role is primed to move onto a C-suite role potentially, as that person would have very good critical thinking skills as well as good working knowledge of the business and sector.


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  #17456 (permalink)  
Old 10-08-2022, 10:15 PM
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Am on the client side. I totally agree. I've been to so many of these law firm client events, talks or seminars.

The international firms really outshine the local firms in terms of marketing, ability to showcase their capabilities, and client attention. SOmething that the local lawyers have yet to wise up to - it's not simply the technical ability (that's expected from all external counsel) but the client servicing that's equally impt.

Let's face facts - you put an angmor lawyer and an asian lawyer in front of an audience, repeating the same content word-for-word, and the angmor lawyer will always appear to have more gravitas (to both the angmor and asian audience). That's the way of the world, esp in this part of the world.

All the local Big 4 lawyers are pretty much fungible apart frm a few specific market-leading teams in certain Big 4s. Local firms honestly need to up their game to be up to scratch with the internationals.
I donít necessarily think itís ang moh v asians - I think itís more of a personality thing. Asians (especially conservative ones) tend to be a bit more soft spoken. IMO big4 tends to attract these sorts. There are other asians who thrive in international firms. These lawyers are very skilled and have the guts to match. Skilled lawyers in international firms are also business minded and can marry commercial sense and legal work. Iíve found this combination of skills to be somewhat lacking in big4 lawyers.
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  #17457 (permalink)  
Old 11-08-2022, 11:34 AM
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Default Taichi

Is Taiching work at the lower associate levels commonplace.
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  #17458 (permalink)  
Old 11-08-2022, 12:18 PM
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Is Taiching work at the lower associate levels commonplace.
Even partners taiji

Presentations speech notes law society investigations interviews charity work grounds of decisions etc

I am shocked at the passing off


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  #17459 (permalink)  
Old 11-08-2022, 03:08 PM
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TKQP/Tan Kok Quan Partnership - Salary, Culture

hello everyone - strongly considering TKQP as a place to train at. Given that our TC is gonna be one year long, I'm quite worried about firm culture and mentorship. Anyone has experience there and/or heard stuff about the firm? Last post about the firm was 2018 so a bit outdated.

Also if anyone has updated salary information on TKQP (or yardsticks based on comparable firms) would be great.
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  #17460 (permalink)  
Old 11-08-2022, 03:20 PM
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What are professional responses to a partner yelling at you in person?

Or tips to fake confidence when getting yelled at? I have a partner that nothing I do is right.

She called and yelled at me yesterday and I had to hang up the phone on her because I was going to start crying.

Iím just nervous how to act in person now.

He undermines everything I do/say and as a new lawyer I donít have a lot of confidence on what to say back to her .

What are some good responses that are still professional to say to an angry partner ?

I donít have experience getting yelled at by people in law school. This is my first job since graduation.

Also is it normal to get yelled at? If so, then I may not switch to another firm. I will just quit practice for good.
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