Lawyer Salary

Originally Posted by Unregistered

I went the "work overseas and come back to Singapore" route and I highly recommend it if it is an option open to you. I spent a few years in London (Magic Circle) and semi-recently moved back to Singapore.

The appeal? Much better work, much better training and much better culture. Quality of work is way higher - far more sophisticated clients than in Asia that value quality more and spend a lot less time bitching about fees. Deals are not mind-numbingly cookie cutter and so your work is a bit more interesting. Training is much better - I heard in Big 4 you aren't allowed to even send external emails as a trainee? Where I was - you get involved in not just client-facing work but BD matters early on. Finally the culture is just way better - ang moh firms are far less intense and seniors look out for juniors - my partners try their best to protect my evenings and weekends and I do the same for my juniors. Even the firms 'notorious' for shitty work culture end work at like 11pm on average whereas I was looking at my Big 4 friends go into the mornings plus Saturdays on the regular.

The result is that when you come back to SG, your perceived market value is higher, your actual abilities are better, you haven't been ground down into a shitty person and you are far less burned out.

Thanks for sharing! I agree, local B4 is just... a bad value proposition.

Originally Posted by Unregistered

Gotta agree. The difference in culture between the B4 and MC firms is quite staggering. I will be fair to the B4 and say that nobody can doubt that they do top-quality work - but the amount of blood, sweat and tears that gets wrung out of their associates in the process of producing that work is far more than in the MC.

I wonder why this is the case though - why do the B4 treat their associates in such a manner?

Originally Posted by Unregistered

I went the "work overseas and come back to Singapore" route and I highly recommend it if it is an option open to you. I spent a few years in London (Magic Circle) and semi-recently moved back to Singapore.

The appeal? Much better work, much better training and much better culture. Quality of work is way higher - far more sophisticated clients than in Asia that value quality more and spend a lot less time bitching about fees. Deals are not mind-numbingly cookie cutter and so your work is a bit more interesting. Training is much better - I heard in Big 4 you aren't allowed to even send external emails as a trainee? Where I was - you get involved in not just client-facing work but BD matters early on. Finally the culture is just way better - ang moh firms are far less intense and seniors look out for juniors - my partners try their best to protect my evenings and weekends and I do the same for my juniors. Even the firms 'notorious' for shitty work culture end work at like 11pm on average whereas I was looking at my Big 4 friends go into the mornings plus Saturdays on the regular.

The result is that when you come back to SG, your perceived market value is higher, your actual abilities are better, you haven't been ground down into a shitty person and you are far less burned out.

Agreed. Thats why all the B4 assocs with real market value have all left for int’ll firms. The ones still remaining, you know i know

Originally Posted by Unregistered

I wonder why this is the case though - why do the B4 treat their associates in such a manner?

Singapore NS culture (or worse) in some B4 teams. You know I know.

Originally Posted by Unregistered

Singapore NS culture (or worse) in some B4 teams. You know I know.

Yeah was always thinking how to describe that culture.
You summed it up well

Originally Posted by Unregistered

Agreed. Thats why all the B4 assocs with real market value have all left for int’ll firms. The ones still remaining, you know i know

Ok wad. The not so elite ones remain in B4 and are almost guaranteed to make junior partner if they don't self-attrition.

In that sense, they're filling a market niche too. The market admits practitioners of varying calibres and strengths.

As a B4 SA, currently awaiting my turn to be made up, I'm more than satisfied with this track. Comp is not fantastic but decent. And my practice area is quite chillax comparatively speaking.

Originally Posted by Unregistered

Ok wad. The not so elite ones remain in B4 and are almost guaranteed to make junior partner if they don't self-attrition.

In that sense, they're filling a market niche too. The market admits practitioners of varying calibres and strengths.

As a B4 SA, currently awaiting my turn to be made up, I'm more than satisfied with this track. Comp is not fantastic but decent. And my practice area is quite chillax comparatively speaking.

In time to come most of these work will become obsolete.
The smart ones in law are already transitioning to areas that will disrupt traditional roles like those described above.
When something is chillax, mundane, repetitive, it’s at risk of disruption.

Originally Posted by Unregistered

In time to come most of these work will become obsolete.
The smart ones in law are already transitioning to areas that will disrupt traditional roles like those described above.
When something is chillax, mundane, repetitive, it’s at risk of disruption.

What are the practice areas facing disruption?

Which practice areas are growing?

Originally Posted by Unregistered

Yeah was always thinking how to describe that culture.
You summed it up well

International firms generally have better culture.

Originally Posted by Unregistered

In time to come most of these work will become obsolete.
The smart ones in law are already transitioning to areas that will disrupt traditional roles like those described above.
When something is chillax, mundane, repetitive, it’s at risk of disruption.

Lol except that the industry as a whole is quite resistant to changes, and it's cheaper to maintain the status quo than "disrupt" the industry.

Also, clients will still want the human touch for even the most mundane work (e.g. document review and DD). I'm not certain why most doomsayers fail to realise that Law is a people-intensive industry for a reason. No matter how "advanced" the AI is for certain tasks, the Corporates will still pay more for the human touch (and to stave off AI/computer errors).

While change is inevitable in most industries, it will almost certainly be slow and gradual in Law. Not least of which because (in most cases) we would actually need to debate/amend laws, and insert updates that allow for xxx to be used/performed.

You can rest assured that even the most chillax jobs that most lawyers are working will not be obsolete till 20 years later (at minimum).