Lawyer Salary

Originally Posted by Unregistered

Aren’t the rest (other than BM) front loaded too?

Re DRD: Goes to show that international tie ups don’t translate to increase in $$.

Re DRD: Is this generally quite true for most of the JLVs (lower $ than B4s)? In that case, people join them (instead of B4s) more for the experience then?

Originally Posted by Unregistered

Re DRD: Is this generally quite true for most of the JLVs (lower $ than B4s)? In that case, people join them (instead of B4s) more for the experience then?

No, for the JLVs like DRD, people join them cause they cant get into the dept they want in B4.

For BMW, there's at least an argument that you get a better starting salary.

Originally Posted by Unregistered

also what is the view on mid career switchers in the legal industry? probably will be more than 10 years older than the avg grad from our local uni after finishing the bar exams etc.

i am in the banking industry but i am not looking to do banking related stuff in legal. my interest lies in policies and economics and the related social impacts.

sounds more social science than law but i guess law has its weight in the issues as well.

honestly it really depends on ur aptitude. the mid career switchers/JDs that i've come across range from very good to very lacking.

common traits for the cmi ones include: inability to tahan ****, lack of humility because they think they're older, thinking that some work is beneath them. this is KEY because law firms don't care how many years u have in so-and-so industry or that you spent $30000 on a JD. you start as a grunt like every 24 or 26 year old NQ, so suck it up and do the menial work. Don't like it? Don't join law.

Common traits for the good ones: ability to talk to and hold their own clients, driven, maturity in thinking, understanding of industry needs. basically client facing soft skills.

"interest lies in policies and economics and the related social impacts." --> suggest u don't do law because commercial law is nowhere close to this (at least the kind of work local firms do) and is incredibly dry. What may come close is AGC's international affairs division or or MFA or MTI (they hire a fair no. of lawyers iirc), or some policy division of a Ministry. Barring AGC, you need to compete with grads from all fields including scholars. Law really wouldn't advantage you compared to a Ministry scholarship holder with an Ivy League degree.

Originally Posted by Unregistered

Link me some linkedin profiles?

It's well-known that the exit opps for BM are subpar compared to WP/AG. Their corp departments are all T2 at best.

Look at firms like Milbank, MoFo etc
I don’t see lawyers from b4 ending up there

Originally Posted by Unregistered

Link me some linkedin profiles?

It's well-known that the exit opps for BM are subpar compared to WP/AG. Their corp departments are all T2 at best.

Probably applies to the larger, well known departments like M&A or banking. A simple Google search shows that BM’s investment funds team is T1, for example.

Originally Posted by Unregistered

Look at firms like Milbank, MoFo etc
I don’t see lawyers from b4 ending up there

I guess because a lot of Big 4 teams have a very local focus. BMWL is quite integrated into the BM network. The cross border experience is way more natural. A lot of laterals also ask for people with experience in international firms.

Big 4 peeps will likely have to move to MC/SC before moving to US firms.

Honestly not all international tie ups are made the same. Look for those where it is actually set up by partners from the international outfit. Even then, pay is often not uniform across the international part and the local part.

Above is of course general sentiments. Many people from big 4 and non big 4s (though lesser for the same reasons above) like TSMP, Stamford, SLB, Rodyk and HEP also do end up in the real international firms and lasting long.

Originally Posted by Unregistered

Look at firms like Milbank, MoFo etc
I don’t see lawyers from b4 ending up there

Agree with OP that the B&M corporate teams may not be as renowned as that at WP/A&G.

Despite so, it’s worthwhile noting that B&M has a decent international brand name (this is where the international tie-up is helpful but must be contrasted w DRD LOL!) Big 4 associates tend to lateral to magic circle firms, and it’s more rare for them to land a US/white shoe/mid-Atlantic role directly from a Big 4 firm (albeit such associates do exist e.g. in Latham, Gunderson and Sidley but are like unicorns and you have to be somewhat of a star associate).

B&M has a good track record of associates directly lateraling to MoFo, Sidley Austin, Milbank etc in certain corporate departments - just go onto the LinkedIn page of each of these firms and change the location to SG to have a look if you’re interested!

I would caveat that US firms in Singapore may require you to be called to the UK/NY bar to be paid the Cravath/new Milbank scale so that’s just food for thought.

2021 has been a hot year for lateral corporate hires from Big 4/ lower tier international firms in SG to MC/US firms in HK and London (with just the SG bar qualification). To my knowledge, such lateral associates in London based US firms would receive the full Cravath scale (barring firms like Jones Day, W&C, etc which are more of a “black box” compensation model). If you’re happy relocating, no harm shooting out an application to try! An added benefit is that the US firm pay war is now leading most UK firms in London to increase comp packages as well

Originally Posted by Unregistered

Agree with OP that the B&M corporate teams may not be as renowned as that at WP/A&G.

Despite so, it’s worthwhile noting that B&M has a decent international brand name (this is where the international tie-up is helpful but must be contrasted w DRD LOL!) Big 4 associates tend to lateral to magic circle firms, and it’s more rare for them to land a US/white shoe/mid-Atlantic role directly from a Big 4 firm (albeit such associates do exist e.g. in Latham, Gunderson and Sidley but are like unicorns and you have to be somewhat of a star associate).

B&M has a good track record of associates directly lateraling to MoFo, Sidley Austin, Milbank etc in certain corporate departments - just go onto the LinkedIn page of each of these firms and change the location to SG to have a look if you’re interested!

I would caveat that US firms in Singapore may require you to be called to the UK/NY bar to be paid the Cravath/new Milbank scale so that’s just food for thought.

2021 has been a hot year for lateral corporate hires from Big 4/ lower tier international firms in SG to MC/US firms in HK and London (with just the SG bar qualification). To my knowledge, such lateral associates in London based US firms would receive the full Cravath scale (barring firms like Jones Day, W&C, etc which are more of a “black box” compensation model). If you’re happy relocating, no harm shooting out an application to try! An added benefit is that the US firm pay war is now leading most UK firms in London to increase comp packages as well

This sounds like a recruiter but oh wells.

Originally Posted by Unregistered

It's also a function of how the local firms are so heavily tilted towards lining the pockets of the senior ranks, especially the EPs. Many of them earn more than their equivalents in international firms, and they can well afford to increase junior associates' pay, but they simply choose not to.

Ya lor.. juniors can’t help but feel a bit jaded, esp cos we’re usually told to just suck it up and be thankful we have a job.. which is amplified when some law firms had decent revenue last year but used COVID as an excuse for shitty bonuses and annual increment for junior associates or even reduced trainee pay

If you’re not happy with your associate role just quit and move in house.
Most of my peers did and they have a better quality of life.
Don’t bother comparing.