Oxford fresh grad starting pay

Originally Posted by Unregistered

On what basis do you say that $5k a month is over-paid?

Banking jobs are limited. The demand to land such jobs far exceed the supply. Like everything that is limited, a system of allocation needs to be in-place. Our society has elected to use the system of meritocracy - We allocate limited resources based on merit.

Perhaps, only the brightest 1-2% of our generation land such jobs. The top graduates from our education system.

What is the cut-off point for public housing? $10k pm. ($12k if you consider EC). What is the proportion living in private housing? About 20%.

So 20% of households should be earning >$10/12k per month. Income disparity rises as you go up the scale.

What should the top 1-2% of our society be earnining? How much do top 1-2% of Doctors, Lawyers, Company management earn in our society? About $1-2 million a year according to PAP. So a starting pay of $5k pm ($60k pa) seems to be on the low side to me.

you should include at least 4 months of bonus inclusive AWS (maybe can up to 8 mth, I dunno), so at least 80k pa!!!

5k is very high is you compare to engineer, it take about 6-7 years to hit 5k basic if you are good performer in the private sector in the same company......

Originally Posted by Unregistered

Perhaps, only the brightest 1-2% of our generation land such jobs. The top graduates from our education system.

If you ask me - it's a total waste for society's brightest to be in banking.

Originally Posted by Unregistered

If you ask me - it's a total waste for society's brightest to be in banking.

So what should they be doing?

Originally Posted by Unregistered

If you ask me - it's a total waste for society's brightest to be in banking.

Idiota....

Andrew Sheng, former Hong Kong central banker, has said, “how do financial engineers make five to ten times more salary than physical engineers year after year? Is there magic in the financial institutions ability to create return on equity that is significantly higher than real-sector companies like automobiles or energy? The answer is that they create risks through leverage and interconnectivity which, every ten years or so, become realised losses that are fully underwritten by the public sector through tax bail-outs. The financial sector is being subsidised by all the holders of financial paper through zero interest rate policies. Their liabilities are still guaranteed by central banks. Finance has become the biggest free rider of all time.”

To put it bluntly, the whole finance sector is a big scam, all thanks to the over-liberalization in USA. The high-earning bankers still say they create a whole lot of value, but their voice is always louder cos they make more money.

Excellent article from Kishore Mahbubani that touches on this:
http://www.mahbubani.net/articles%20...rom%20Asia.pdf

Originally Posted by Unregistered

On what basis do you say that $5k a month is over-paid?

Banking jobs are limited. The demand to land such jobs far exceed the supply. Like everything that is limited, a system of allocation needs to be in-place. Our society has elected to use the system of meritocracy - We allocate limited resources based on merit.

Perhaps, only the brightest 1-2% of our generation land such jobs. The top graduates from our education system.

What is the cut-off point for public housing? $10k pm. ($12k if you consider EC). What is the proportion living in private housing? About 20%.

So 20% of households should be earning >$10/12k per month. Income disparity rises as you go up the scale.

What should the top 1-2% of our society be earnining? How much do top 1-2% of Doctors, Lawyers, Company management earn in our society? About $1-2 million a year according to PAP. So a starting pay of $5k pm ($60k pa) seems to be on the low side to me.

If you are the top 5% of the talent pool, you should get paid. That's meritocracy.

The industry that can pay the most will get its allocation of resources. If banking pays the best, it will get the people. Don't blame the bankers. They are just obeying the laws of the free market.

Isn't this the rationale our own PAP has adopted?

Originally Posted by Unregistered

If you are the top 5% of the talent pool, you should get paid. That's meritocracy.

The industry that can pay the most will get its allocation of resources. If banking pays the best, it will get the people. Don't blame the bankers. They are just obeying the laws of the free market.

Isn't this the rationale our own PAP has adopted?

The government and regulators should get more blame for helping to distort the talent allocation and for allowing the finance industry to become unnecessarily big.

Just look at Singapore. Nobody wants to study engineering any more. Everyone and his cousin just wants to work in a bank. Probably the same situation in many other countries too.

Let me quote Andrew Sheng again: "Is there magic in the financial institutions ability to create return on equity that is significantly higher than real-sector companies like automobiles or energy?"

As he's a former central banker himself, I'm sure he knows he's part of the problem, except that the problem is too huge for him to fix alone.

"Why should a financial engineer be paid four to a hundred times more than a real engineer? A real engineer builds bridges. A financial engineer builds dreams and, when those dreams turn out to be nightmares, other people pay for it." —Andrew Sheng, in an interview for the 2010 financial industry documentary Inside Job.[6]

Andrew Sheng - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Let's say a civil engineer helps build a house and the developer puts it on the market for sale.

Do you need a house? Yes. But before you can get the house, what do you really need? Ans: YOU NEED A LOAN. No loan no house.

Let's say a mechanical engineer aids in building a car and the manufacturer puts it on sale.
Do you need a car? No, but you surely would like to have one. What do you need?
Ans: AUTO Loan.

How about both the developer and the manufacturer? What they need? They need working capital. They can issue shares or take a loan.. from who? Ans: Banker

So bankers manufacture alot of Products that society NEEDs.

We manufacture Dreams. Rather, we manufactur the product you need to obtain all your Wordly Dreams. So why shouldn't we get paid more than the Engineer?

Originally Posted by Unregistered

Let's say a civil engineer helps build a house and the developer puts it on the market for sale.

Do you need a house? Yes. But before you can get the house, what do you really need? Ans: YOU NEED A LOAN. No loan no house.

Let's say a mechanical engineer aids in building a car and the manufacturer puts it on sale.
Do you need a car? No, but you surely would like to have one. What do you need?
Ans: AUTO Loan.

How about both the developer and the manufacturer? What they need? They need working capital. They can issue shares or take a loan.. from who? Ans: Banker

So bankers manufacture alot of Products that society NEEDs.

We manufacture Dreams. Rather, we manufactur the product you need to obtain all your Wordly Dreams. So why shouldn't we get paid more than the Engineer?

well, if bankers stuck with doing house loans, auto loans etc, instead of developing fancy financial products, then they definitely wouldn't have such a bad rep right now.
yes, bankers manufacture dreams. the money exists only in the dreamworld. it doesn't exist in real life.