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-   -   Q: Big4 - Yearly salary increment (https://forums.salary.sg/income-jobs/1506-q-big4-yearly-salary-increment.html)

Unregistered 25-02-2015 05:16 PM

Big 4 employee joining as Sr. Manager in Singapore big4
 
Hi All

I am joining a big 4 in Singapore from another big 4 in different country. I have been offered 12k+800(twds CPF) for joining as Sr. Manager. I am already a senior manager for 2 years with existing firm.

Please advice if this is reasonable

Rgds
big4 employee

Unregistered 25-02-2015 05:22 PM

How much % increment is this move to you ?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 63306)
Hi All

I am joining a big 4 in Singapore from another big 4 in different country. I have been offered 12k+800(twds CPF) for joining as Sr. Manager. I am already a senior manager for 2 years with existing firm.

Please advice if this is reasonable

Rgds
big4 employee


Unregistered 25-02-2015 05:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 63306)
Hi All

I am joining a big 4 in Singapore from another big 4 in different country. I have been offered 12k+800(twds CPF) for joining as Sr. Manager. I am already a senior manager for 2 years with existing firm.

Please advice if this is reasonable

Rgds
big4 employee

How many years of working experience do u have?

Unregistered 25-02-2015 05:34 PM

12k is near to max of snr mgr, meaning future increments will be very little unless ur rated top performer or get a promotion. If I were you I will go back to them and say 12k is fine, but request to be put on associate director grade. at least then u will be at average level of ass. director & get the normal increment

Unregistered 25-02-2015 05:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 63306)
Hi All

I am joining a big 4 in Singapore from another big 4 in different country. I have been offered 12k+800(twds CPF) for joining as Sr. Manager. I am already a senior manager for 2 years with existing firm.

Please advice if this is reasonable

Rgds
big4 employee

Foreign talent spotted...

Unregistered 25-02-2015 06:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 63310)
Foreign talent spotted...

Sometimes I also wonder why our immigration policy let in all sorts of FT. I can understand manual labour and top management maybe need outsiders, but a Senior Manager in Big 4 is just a junior-mid level job that is usually paid 8-9k. You mean companies cannot find local citizens and need to pay some foreigner 30-40% more above local pay just to do the same work? Or is it another case of foreigner hiring their own cliques again?

Unregistered 25-02-2015 07:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 63312)
Sometimes I also wonder why our immigration policy let in all sorts of FT. I can understand manual labour and top management maybe need outsiders, but a Senior Manager in Big 4 is just a junior-mid level job that is usually paid 8-9k. You mean companies cannot find local citizens and need to pay some foreigner 30-40% more above local pay just to do the same work? Or is it another case of foreigner hiring their own cliques again?

it could be that the job requires international exposure which can be difficult for local applicant. after all the domestic market of Singapore is so small that almost all business operation here has some foreign exposure.

Unregistered 25-02-2015 10:52 PM

Hey Guys, Thanks for your comments...I might have made a small mistake in my post..i am joining as Associate Director and not senior manager. Actually, in my country sr. manager and AD are same levels and some practices such as tax use the term Sr. Manager and Consulting uses AD. Isnt it the same in Singapore or is AD is higher in hierarchy than Sr. Manager

I have approx. 12 yrs of experience in my field of expertise and given the difference in currency, it is a decent jump. However, the objective for me is to gain experience in an international location like Singapore which is the best market Asia has to offer and is a beautiful place to stay. Having said that, I want to be treated at par in accordance with my grade. I am a 2nd year AD in my home practice.

On the immigration policy comment, no clues mate...I am just trying to make my two ends meet and do the best for my career and btw don't think that anyone will pay premium until they see some potential in it. Cheers

Unregistered 26-02-2015 01:03 AM

Just to digress a bit, can anyone confirm if it is normal for a Associate Director in a big 4 to be paid 12k? I am now in the final interview round with PWC for an Associate Director role and when the subject of pay come up, HR keep hinting that they cannot give anything more than my current pay which is 10.6k due to "internal benchmark". I want to know if it's really true or just some negotiation tactic.

Unregistered 26-02-2015 10:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 63341)
Just to digress a bit, can anyone confirm if it is normal for a Associate Director in a big 4 to be paid 12k? I am now in the final interview round with PWC for an Associate Director role and when the subject of pay come up, HR keep hinting that they cannot give anything more than my current pay which is 10.6k due to "internal benchmark". I want to know if it's really true or just some negotiation tactic.

Average for AD is 10-11k, but Iím sure if the company want you enough they can easily up to 12k or even more.

Unregistered 26-02-2015 01:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 63353)
Average for AD is 10-11k, but Iím sure if the company want you enough they can easily up to 12k or even more.

In my country, within the designations, there is year wise brackets so it depends if you are joining as AD1 or AD2 or AD3...I have been told that I am being taken in as AD3

Unregistered 26-02-2015 07:37 PM

Director level salary
 
Hello everyone, I am talking to one of the big4 for director level position based out of Singapore in advisory function. Can you tell me what is the sal range for a first year director in a big4 being based in Singapore. I have been quoted 13.5K monthly...is it high, reasonable or low

Unregistered 27-02-2015 08:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 63385)
Hello everyone, I am talking to one of the big4 for director level position based out of Singapore in advisory function. Can you tell me what is the sal range for a first year director in a big4 being based in Singapore. I have been quoted 13.5K monthly...is it high, reasonable or low

13.5 is on low side, i know one at director level for basel risk consulting/advisory getting paid 18k

Unregistered 28-02-2015 09:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 63341)
Just to digress a bit, can anyone confirm if it is normal for a Associate Director in a big 4 to be paid 12k? I am now in the final interview round with PWC for an Associate Director role and when the subject of pay come up, HR keep hinting that they cannot give anything more than my current pay which is 10.6k due to "internal benchmark". I want to know if it's really true or just some negotiation tactic.

It depends on which Big 4 you are going to... if you're talking about the 3 lettered one, wow 10.6k for AD3 is kinda low considering the top grade SM (SM3/4, I forgot which) earns close to 10k. So only 600+ increment for 3 years of AD?

Don't forget to factor in the poor bonuses in Big 4... 2-3 months may be the norm there, that's including 13th month.

Unregistered 28-02-2015 11:01 AM

[QUOTE=Unregistered;63463]It depends on which Big 4 you are going to... if you're talking about the 3 lettered one, wow 10.6k for AD3 is kinda low considering the top grade SM (SM3/4, I forgot which) earns close to 10k. So only 600+ increment for 3 years of AD?

Don't forget to factor in the poor bonuses in Big 4... 2-3 months may be the norm there, that's including 13th month.[/QUOTEA couple of misconceptions here.
1) PWC (& I think the other 3 as wee) does not pay AWS. So what you get in bonus is all variable.
2) You cant compare the max of a SM with the min of a AD. You can only compare mid/average against mid/average. It is normal for the max of the grade before to be higher than the min of the next grade. In some levels the max of the lower grade might even be higher than the mid of the higher grade.

Unregistered 02-03-2015 02:16 PM

[QUOTE=Unregistered;63469]
Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 63463)
It depends on which Big 4 you are going to... if you're talking about the 3 lettered one, wow 10.6k for AD3 is kinda low considering the top grade SM (SM3/4, I forgot which) earns close to 10k. So only 600+ increment for 3 years of AD?

Don't forget to factor in the poor bonuses in Big 4... 2-3 months may be the norm there, that's including 13th month.[/QUOTEA couple of misconceptions here.
1) PWC (& I think the other 3 as wee) does not pay AWS. So what you get in bonus is all variable.
2) You cant compare the max of a SM with the min of a AD. You can only compare mid/average against mid/average. It is normal for the max of the grade before to be higher than the min of the next grade. In some levels the max of the lower grade might even be higher than the mid of the higher grade.

Given that an average SM reaches close to 10k before being promoted to AD1, AD3 at 10.6k is slightly low. SM to AD3 is 3 years of promotion and 10.6k implies only about $300 plus per promotion which is slightly below the norm. A SM who stays in the big 4 and gets promoted to AD3 will probably be drawing closer to 12k

A simple scale for first 5 years is:
A1 - 2700
A2 - 3100
SA1 - 3500
SA2 - 4500
AM - 5100

We're talking about 400-500 increment each time you are promoted. This is big 4 and not civil service where we have overlapping salary ranges and someone at MX11 can be paid more than someone at MX10.

Unregistered 02-03-2015 04:50 PM

[QUOTE=Unregistered;63564]
Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 63469)
We're talking about 400-500 increment each time you are promoted. This is big 4 and not civil service where we have overlapping salary ranges and someone at MX11 can be paid more than someone at MX10.

I don't think that is correct, at least for EY. In fact it is common complain there that the old birds at a certain rank end up higher paid than their boss, esp if its just 1 grade difference.

Unregistered 02-03-2015 08:27 PM

[QUOTE=Unregistered;63564]
Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 63469)

A simple scale for first 5 years is:
A1 - 2700
A2 - 3100
SA1 - 3500
SA2 - 4500
AM - 5100

What about for deal advisory or consulting departments? A1s start >3k but what is the salary progression after that?

Unregistered 03-03-2015 03:49 PM

[QUOTE=Unregistered;63577]
Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 63564)

What about for deal advisory or consulting departments? A1s start >3k but what is the salary progression after that?

friendly warning, a 3 lettered big4 consulting may be a shithole right now, of course depends on which consulting dept you are going to.

salary progression:
a1 3500 with no bonus
a2 3500
sa1 4000
sa2 4500
am 5100
m1 5x00

as shown, high starting salary is just to entice you, without a bonus your annual salary is actually behind other consulting peers.

Unregistered 03-03-2015 04:28 PM

[QUOTE=Unregistered;63592]
Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 63577)

friendly warning, a 3 lettered big4 consulting may be a shithole right now, of course depends on which consulting dept you are going to.

salary progression:
a1 3500 with no bonus
a2 3500
sa1 4000
sa2 4500
am 5100
m1 5x00

as shown, high starting salary is just to entice you, without a bonus your annual salary is actually behind other consulting peers.

Interesting, thanks for your insight. Just as a gauge, are you working at one of the big 4 consulting divisions? And, does the salary progression mean no salary increment from A1 to A2 but A2 but rather an included bonus?

Unregistered 03-03-2015 08:19 PM

[QUOTE=Unregistered;63592]
Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 63577)

friendly warning, a 3 lettered big4 consulting may be a shithole right now, of course depends on which consulting dept you are going to.

salary progression:
a1 3500 with no bonus
a2 3500
sa1 4000
sa2 4500
am 5100
m1 5x00

as shown, high starting salary is just to entice you, without a bonus your annual salary is actually behind other consulting peers.

Does this apply for corporate finance (M&A) too?

For example, for those that lateral hired from IB to M&A in big 4 (e.g. for a better lifestyle), how would their compensation level be decided?

Unregistered 03-03-2015 11:13 PM

[QUOTE=Unregistered;63592]
Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 63577)

friendly warning, a 3 lettered big4 consulting may be a shithole right now, of course depends on which consulting dept you are going to.

salary progression:
a1 3500 with no bonus
a2 3500
sa1 4000
sa2 4500
am 5100
m1 5x00

as shown, high starting salary is just to entice you, without a bonus your annual salary is actually behind other consulting peers.

My friend just got into tax consulting side at PWC, only offered 3k as associate, where got 3.5k as indicated? Or only selected special consulting & advisory then got 3.5k?

Unregistered 05-03-2015 06:32 PM

[QUOTE=Unregistered;63612]
Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 63592)

My friend just got into tax consulting side at PWC, only offered 3k as associate, where got 3.5k as indicated? Or only selected special consulting & advisory then got 3.5k?

thats cos tax consulting is not consulting, it is still under the tax dept. standard 3 depts: assurance, advisory, tax. the salary scale above is for advisory dept. in advisory dept there is also a consulting section, such as management consulting, IT consulting.

3k for associate is already a pay rise from previous years, not bad. used to be 2.7k entry.

Unregistered 05-03-2015 06:35 PM

[QUOTE=Unregistered;63594]
Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 63592)

Interesting, thanks for your insight. Just as a gauge, are you working at one of the big 4 consulting divisions? And, does the salary progression mean no salary increment from A1 to A2 but A2 but rather an included bonus?

they increased starting pay of A1 to make it more attractive, but removed your bonus. if you do the calculations it is still more worth it. only when you are A2 then you will get a bonus at the end of the fy.

old salary scheme
2.7k x (12 + 2) = 37.8k (assume 2 mths bonus)

current salary scheme
3.5k x 12 = 42k

Unregistered 05-03-2015 07:22 PM

Sorry but I'm not getting the logic here, hope experienced bros can help clarify. So meaning on the first year joining PWC is just 3k x 12 with nothing else? No bonus no aws?

I mean I'm a bit shocked that a Big 4 can offer such lousy terms that is even worse than SME starting pay. AFAIK even a SIM grad joining a small local firm can get 2.5k x 12 + aws + 1.5-2mths variable which actually end up higher than PWC annual.

I know the big 4 emphasize how their increment better, after few years better on the cv to look for other jobs etc. But honestly very shock that it can be so pathetic low at the start. If it's really that bad then I can understand now why so many of uni coursemate majoring in Finance are so desperate to join the banking side even if as back office admin support.

Unregistered 06-03-2015 12:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 63685)
Sorry but I'm not getting the logic here, hope experienced bros can help clarify. So meaning on the first year joining PWC is just 3k x 12 with nothing else? No bonus no aws?

I mean I'm a bit shocked that a Big 4 can offer such lousy terms that is even worse than SME starting pay. AFAIK even a SIM grad joining a small local firm can get 2.5k x 12 + aws + 1.5-2mths variable which actually end up higher than PWC annual.

I know the big 4 emphasize how their increment better, after few years better on the cv to look for other jobs etc. But honestly very shock that it can be so pathetic low at the start. If it's really that bad then I can understand now why so many of uni coursemate majoring in Finance are so desperate to join the banking side even if as back office admin support.

The big4 treat the mass hiring of low level staff as dispensible, so they never bother to pay high.

Even the supposed "high" and "fast" pay and career promotion isn't that great either. A typical big 4 associate get his manager after 5 year paid around 5k and maybe 1.5-2mths bonus, no aws. That's like 65-70k annual after 5 years, doesn't sound impressive to me either.

A FCH guy with NS fresh grad can join civil service at 4k + merit component + performance bonus easily works out to 16 months which is almost the same as 5 year exp big4 annually.

Unregistered 06-03-2015 12:00 PM

hi all, quick question

I will be graduating this year and i have signed on with KPMG as i think i have chance for 1st honours, thus the increase pay. So if i really manage to get 1st class, to get the increased pay, do i just collaborate with KPMG's HR? or does the additional salary not apply if i signed on (there is no mention of wage increasing if you sign on with KPMG on the contract).

thanks in advance

Unregistered 06-03-2015 12:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 63711)
hi all, quick question

I will be graduating this year and i have signed on with KPMG as i think i have chance for 1st honours, thus the increase pay. So if i really manage to get 1st class, to get the increased pay, do i just collaborate with KPMG's HR? or does the additional salary not apply if i signed on (there is no mention of wage increasing if you sign on with KPMG on the contract).

thanks in advance

Since when did KPMG practise increasing offer on the go based on university results? If it's not in your employment contract, from whom did you hear this from?

On a side note, I am quite disturbed at the level of English displayed by a supposed FCH graduate, I hope this is not a true reflection of your language standards.

Unregistered 06-03-2015 12:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 63685)
Sorry but I'm not getting the logic here, hope experienced bros can help clarify. So meaning on the first year joining PWC is just 3k x 12 with nothing else? No bonus no aws?

I mean I'm a bit shocked that a Big 4 can offer such lousy terms that is even worse than SME starting pay. AFAIK even a SIM grad joining a small local firm can get 2.5k x 12 + aws + 1.5-2mths variable which actually end up higher than PWC annual.

I know the big 4 emphasize how their increment better, after few years better on the cv to look for other jobs etc. But honestly very shock that it can be so pathetic low at the start. If it's really that bad then I can understand now why so many of uni coursemate majoring in Finance are so desperate to join the banking side even if as back office admin support.

Unfortunately, the Big 4s are not known for offering a competitive package or decent working hours especially when it comes to fresh graduates. Whether it's 3k without bonus or 2.7k with a little bonus as shared by most others earlier, the end result is a pay package that is below average at best and work hours that range from barely acceptable to horrendous.

To answer your question, how do they get away with such lousy offers? They mainly rely on 2 selling points, supposedly better increments at least for the first few years with them and more importantly, the perception that big MNCs prefer candidates with some Big 4 experience.

Many young grads basically suck thumb and treat this as serving "NS" for a few years in the hopes of picking up a better Finance job in a big MNC in the future. Fact of the matter is there are only so many big MNC/banking fresh grad positions available and usually only the best 20% of the cohort get them. Paying your dues in the Big4 remains a common option for the rest of the Finance grads to have a hope of building a future career.

Unregistered 09-03-2015 03:54 PM

Associate Director - D2
 
I have an offer from (4 letter word big4) which shows title as Associate Director (D2) - would anyone know what is meant by D2 - IS it some grading/ ranking - if yes, then what is the grading structure.

The salary offered is 12K including CPF, is it at par with industry standards of big4 in Singapore. The role is in consulting function possibly RC/MC

I need to respond on this offer, request your help in getting some insight

Unregistered 09-03-2015 04:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 63858)
I have an offer from (4 letter word big4) which shows title as Associate Director (D2) - would anyone know what is meant by D2 - IS it some grading/ ranking - if yes, then what is the grading structure.

The salary offered is 12K including CPF, is it at par with industry standards of big4 in Singapore. The role is in consulting function possibly RC/MC

I need to respond on this offer, request your help in getting some insight

why don't you try asking the HR instead?

Unregistered 09-03-2015 04:44 PM

Associate Director - D2
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 63859)
why don't you try asking the HR instead?

Thanks for guidance, I will definitely reach out to HR but need some advice from people already in the big4 and having some knowledge on it. It will give us more clarity and make it more informative discussion with the HR

Unregistered 10-03-2015 03:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 63685)
Sorry but I'm not getting the logic here, hope experienced bros can help clarify. So meaning on the first year joining PWC is just 3k x 12 with nothing else? No bonus no aws?

I mean I'm a bit shocked that a Big 4 can offer such lousy terms that is even worse than SME starting pay. AFAIK even a SIM grad joining a small local firm can get 2.5k x 12 + aws + 1.5-2mths variable which actually end up higher than PWC annual.

I know the big 4 emphasize how their increment better, after few years better on the cv to look for other jobs etc. But honestly very shock that it can be so pathetic low at the start. If it's really that bad then I can understand now why so many of uni coursemate majoring in Finance are so desperate to join the banking side even if as back office admin support.

I wld like to clarify that I have not heard of any 3k x 12 offers. In a certain big 4 dept (as previously mentioned a few times in the last page) the first yr salary is 3.5k x 12. No aws, no bonus.

All other depts are 2.7k x 12 + bonus. Someone here mentioned 3k so maybe big 4 has adjusted their starting salary for 2015. For 2014 fresh grad pay was still 2.7k.

I also agree with some other comments here regarding big 4 in general. 90% of people who enter big 4 treat it as a stepping stone to get into mncs after 3-4 years of experience. only those truly crazy stay on past yr 5 to become managers and continue earning the lousy pay for the crazy hours. big 4 like to say they give good increments but even if 6k after 6 years is good, dont forget most people work 8 hour days while as a manager you will be working closer to 10, not to mention bringing work home or working over the wkends which is the norm during peak periods. once you factor in all the extra work you do, your hourly rate is probably no better than a jc temp staff after a-levels.

i used to be from big 4, left and never looked back.

Unregistered 10-03-2015 04:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 63898)
I wld like to clarify that I have not heard of any 3k x 12 offers. In a certain big 4 dept (as previously mentioned a few times in the last page) the first yr salary is 3.5k x 12. No aws, no bonus.

All other depts are 2.7k x 12 + bonus. Someone here mentioned 3k so maybe big 4 has adjusted their starting salary for 2015. For 2014 fresh grad pay was still 2.7k.

I also agree with some other comments here regarding big 4 in general. 90% of people who enter big 4 treat it as a stepping stone to get into mncs after 3-4 years of experience. only those truly crazy stay on past yr 5 to become managers and continue earning the lousy pay for the crazy hours. big 4 like to say they give good increments but even if 6k after 6 years is good, dont forget most people work 8 hour days while as a manager you will be working closer to 10, not to mention bringing work home or working over the wkends which is the norm during peak periods. once you factor in all the extra work you do, your hourly rate is probably no better than a jc temp staff after a-levels.

i used to be from big 4, left and never looked back.

The problem with big4 is unless u make it to partner level and get the generous profit sharing scheme, the bonuses are so pathetic that its just not worth all the crazy hours.

We are not even talking about comparing to big boys in rich industries like banking or oil/gas .... The typical big4 Manager / Director gets like 2-3 mths on average and maybe 5 mths for top performer without even AWS. It's just not worth working 70-90hr work week for this sort of package.

Unregistered 12-03-2015 06:18 AM

How difficult is it to get into big 4 management consulting?

What is the remuneration like?

Cheers

Unregistered 12-03-2015 01:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 63971)
How difficult is it to get into big 4 management consulting?

What is the remuneration like?

Cheers

Already shown above. Big 4 is way easier than the real consulting companies because they aren't real consultants.

Unregistered 12-03-2015 07:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 63989)
Already shown above. Big 4 is way easier than the real consulting companies because they aren't real consultants.

What do you mean they aren't real consultants? As in they are fake consultants? I would refrain from making such sweeping statements.

Both Deloitte Consulting and PwC Consulting are ranked in the top 6 consulting practices in terms of prestige according to Vault rankings (above the likes of L.E.K, Accenture and Oliver Wyman, mind). MBB dominates the market as strategy houses but by no means are the big 4 not "real consultants".

In terms of difficulty getting in, big 4 consulting practices have a more difficult interview process than the other functions (tax, audit). A couple of them require candidates to go through assessment centres. I wouldn't compare the interview process with the ones in the U.S. but I don't believe they are by any means 'easy' in any case.

Cheers

Unregistered 12-03-2015 07:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 63989)
Already shown above. Big 4 is way easier than the real consulting companies because they aren't real consultants.

u sound like downie bro

Unregistered 12-03-2015 07:56 PM

[QUOTE=Unregistered;63592]
Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 63577)

friendly warning, a 3 lettered big4 consulting may be a shithole right now, of course depends on which consulting dept you are going to.

salary progression:
a1 3500 with no bonus
a2 3500
sa1 4000
sa2 4500
am 5100
m1 5x00

as shown, high starting salary is just to entice you, without a bonus your annual salary is actually behind other consulting peers.

may I know why is it a shithole now? having trouble?

Unregistered 13-03-2015 12:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 64007)
What do you mean they aren't real consultants? As in they are fake consultants? I would refrain from making such sweeping statements.

Both Deloitte Consulting and PwC Consulting are ranked in the top 6 consulting practices in terms of prestige according to Vault rankings (above the likes of L.E.K, Accenture and Oliver Wyman, mind). MBB dominates the market as strategy houses but by no means are the big 4 not "real consultants".

In terms of difficulty getting in, big 4 consulting practices have a more difficult interview process than the other functions (tax, audit). A couple of them require candidates to go through assessment centres. I wouldn't compare the interview process with the ones in the U.S. but I don't believe they are by any means 'easy' in any case.

Cheers

While I agree that calling big 4 fake consultants is sweeping and going overboard, neither is hyping or over-seliing them any better.

Sure, go out into the job market & tell ppl a Deloitte or PWC consultant is more "prestigious" than Oliver Wyman and see how many ppl out there are gonna be impressed.

All these rankings will just show whatever they want depending on what methdology they use. Heck even the likes of SIA/Keppel/Singtel gets ranked top employer of choice in some surveys, but go out into the job market and see who really if get offered by investment banks, o&g majors, top IT firms etc will give up and join SIA/Keppel/Singtel

The fact that these Big 4 even get questioned and ppl need to jump in to "defend" already shows they are far from being prestigious. You make it sound as if PWC & Deloitte is just ranked slightly lower than MBB, that is an understatment of the year.

A typical MBB freshie is usually a dean's list type top student from a world renowned business school with an illustrious internship experience or gets involved in other activities like NGOs/foundations/activism etc. A typical Big 4 managment consultant freshie is more likely a local university 2nd upper student. The difference cannot be starker.


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