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BonyBondo 15-08-2012 02:28 PM

just my 2 cents worth of opinion (I'm year 2 UOL student going Yr 3)

when negotiating for salary, it is important that you know your self-worthiness:

-what hard/technical skills do you have? E.g. (SAP,MYOB,VBA,Bloomberg,Factset,Excel,Access, Financial Modeling and etc.) on top of your honors

-what is your past experience in the related field (it could be a short stint internship or part-time work during your vacation) that you can bring to the coy. And by this I don't mean generic stuff like teamwork, leadership or soft skills. Everyone can tell you they are good at this but talk is cheap.

-To reinforce the aforementioned point, some of the things I do will be do get testimonials from my ex-employers from my internships, present your research work that you've done previously and RESULTS you can bring to the interviewer.

-Don't be lazy and please do some "due diligence" and market research to know how firms are paying. Make sure your sample size and source are large and reliable enough. Asking for opinions from this forum can be very skewed and can potentially distort the picture.

-And finally, be a self-motivated learner. Preparing for the job market is not just an affair of 2 or 3 months worth of hard work. For peeps who still have a bit of time left, please get to understand the field you are fairly interested in and know how you can be more valuable in the market.

SIM UOL course is a very technical, self-disciplined course.
If you know you are not exactly very good in it, start working on different "selling proposition"

At the end of the day, you decide your own future.
Most of my peers in SIM are just simply demoralising each other about how bad the job market is; how companies are treating SIM students differently etc. etc.

Well... don't let yourself be part of the statistics or the trend. Prove them otherwise!

NEXT 15-08-2012 04:25 PM

Quote:

just my 2 cents worth of opinion (I'm year 2 UOL student going Yr 3)

when negotiating for salary, it is important that you know your self-worthiness:
Appreciate your thoughts, but IMO they are good general pointers on how to prepare for interview and hopefully get an offer, but based on my experience they have little value in preparing you for salary negotation, i.e. ask for more money.

Quote:

Originally Posted by BonyBondo (Post 27550)
-what hard/technical skills do you have? E.g. (SAP,MYOB,VBA,Bloomberg,Factset,Excel,Access, Financial Modeling and etc.) on top of your honors

Grads are already putting these computer skills they know into CV. For a fresh grad, emphasizing on your limited extra curricular skills might help a little during the interview process, but it won't be useful when asking for a few hundred dollars more during salary negotiation.

Quote:

-what is your past experience in the related field (it could be a short stint internship or part-time work during your vacation) that you can bring to the coy. And by this I don't mean generic stuff like teamwork, leadership or soft skills. Everyone can tell you they are good at this but talk is cheap.
I'm sure all grads put in their internship / part time summer jobs into CV, the fact is short stints at such junior levels are not going to give you the competitive edge to ask for more $$$ during salary negotiation. Besides there's a limit to how much technical competency you can exaggerate from these things where most grads would have already gone through.

Quote:

-To reinforce the aforementioned point, some of the things I do will be do get testimonials from my ex-employers from my internships, present your research work that you've done previously and RESULTS you can bring to the interviewer.
Again, this might help during interview, but to use a reference from ex-employer in some part time job for salary negotiation, nah not gona work.

As for presenting academic research work, it only applies to a small number of jobs. Most corporate or ops jobs will not even bother since it does not have much to do with actual work.

Quote:

-Don't be lazy and please do some "due diligence" and market research to know how firms are paying. Make sure your sample size and source are large and reliable enough. Asking for opinions from this forum can be very skewed and can potentially distort the picture.
Easier said than done. How exactly do you "make sure" your sample size is large & reliable? Walk around during convocation asking fellow grads how much money they make? That's going to get you lots of hearsay & unverifiable stories. How is that different from asking online?

Download those public survey from recruiters or universities with an agenda to bump up the numbers as high as possible?

Except for public sector that is quite transparent, the only other way to get reliable data is to engage management consultants to do a pricing, but they don't come cheap. Last I check it was USD850++

Quote:

-And finally, be a self-motivated learner. Preparing for the job market is not just an affair of 2 or 3 months worth of hard work. For peeps who still have a bit of time left, please get to understand the field you are fairly interested in and know how you can be more valuable in the market.

SIM UOL course is a very technical, self-disciplined course.
If you know you are not exactly very good in it, start working on different "selling proposition"
Those are just generic statements. What does it actually mean in terms of actionable items to bargain for higher pay?

BonyBondo 15-08-2012 05:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NEXT (Post 27553)
Appreciate your thoughts, but IMO they are good general pointers on how to prepare for interview and hopefully get an offer, but based on my experience they have little value in preparing you for salary negotation, i.e. ask for more money.



Grads are already putting these computer skills they know into CV. For a fresh grad, emphasizing on your limited extra curricular skills might help a little during the interview process, but it won't be useful when asking for a few hundred dollars more during salary negotiation.



I'm sure all grads put in their internship / part time summer jobs into CV, the fact is short stints at such junior levels are not going to give you the competitive edge to ask for more $$$ during salary negotiation. Besides there's a limit to how much technical competency you can exaggerate from these things where most grads would have already gone through.



Again, this might help during interview, but to use a reference from ex-employer in some part time job for salary negotiation, nah not gona work.

As for presenting academic research work, it only applies to a small number of jobs. Most corporate or ops jobs will not even bother since it does not have much to do with actual work.



Easier said than done. How exactly do you "make sure" your sample size is large & reliable? Walk around during convocation asking fellow grads how much money they make? That's going to get you lots of hearsay & unverifiable stories. How is that different from asking online?

Download those public survey from recruiters or universities with an agenda to bump up the numbers as high as possible?

Except for public sector that is quite transparent, the only other way to get reliable data is to engage management consultants to do a pricing, but they don't come cheap. Last I check it was USD850++



Those are just generic statements. What does it actually mean in terms of actionable items to bargain for higher pay?

Hi NEXT,

Thanks for the quick discernment on my comments earlier on. Based on what you've said, you seen to have been through the process and I assume you are already in the workforce?

That being said, could you shed some light on what you would have done for a fresh grad negotiating for a job instead? Cheers.

Unregistered 15-08-2012 06:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BonyBondo (Post 27555)
Hi NEXT,

Thanks for the quick discernment on my comments earlier on. Based on what you've said, you seen to have been through the process and I assume you are already in the workforce?

That being said, could you shed some light on what you would have done for a fresh grad negotiating for a job instead? Cheers.

IMO there is little room for salary negotiation for a fresh grad from a normal uni, you guys will be starting off from a blank slate, what chips are there to use for bargaining with your employer?

Public Sector - Fresh grad pay fixed depending on uni & academic grades, negotiations not entertained

MNC / GLC - Fresh grad pay within a narrow range as defined by company policy on each position, HR will not make exceptions just because your Excel skills are good or you had a good reference from your last part time job

SME - No holds barred fend for yourself market. If you get lowballed, tell them to get lost & walk out if you can afford to wait, if not LLST & accept to get some experience.

Unregistered 23-08-2012 09:19 AM

UOL PT Year 1
 
Hi All

I'm currently a UOL PT Year 1 Student and have 2.5years working experience in Human resource (studied Diploma in Business studies, specialised in HR back in Poly time). Was working in a PTE co after i graduated from poly and working in a MNC now since Nov 2011. Before i left my first co, i was paid $1900 and currently, i'm drawing a salary of $2400.

How much salary do you i think can ask for after i graduated from UOL with a degree of 2nd upper or 2nd lower class honours in maybe 2 - 3 years time?

Thanks

Unregistered 23-08-2012 11:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 27699)
Hi All

I'm currently a UOL PT Year 1 Student and have 2.5years working experience in Human resource (studied Diploma in Business studies, specialised in HR back in Poly time). Was working in a PTE co after i graduated from poly and working in a MNC now since Nov 2011. Before i left my first co, i was paid $1900 and currently, i'm drawing a salary of $2400.

How much salary do you i think can ask for after i graduated from UOL with a degree of 2nd upper or 2nd lower class honours in maybe 2 - 3 years time?

Thanks

Mid career pay varies greatly based on what job you are doing, not because you took some pte uni degree which everyone is doing. You as a HR person (somemore in MNC) should know better than to ask this kind of layman question.

Unregistered 23-08-2012 01:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 27708)
Mid career pay varies greatly based on what job you are doing, not because you took some pte uni degree which everyone is doing. You as a HR person (somemore in MNC) should know better than to ask this kind of layman question.


But I am not working in as a HR. I'm working as a Training Executive in my co which is under a Engineering Department not in the HR. So I am trying to understand what is the market rate for the pay (MNC) i will be getting after i've graduated.

Unregistered 23-08-2012 02:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 27711)
But I am not working in as a HR. I'm working as a Training Executive in my co which is under a Engineering Department not in the HR. So I am trying to understand what is the market rate for the pay (MNC) i will be getting after i've graduated.

Like I said earlier, there is no such thing as "market pay after graduation", there is only market pay for a particular job.

If after graduation you are still doing a Training Exec or Senior Exec job, why should any Company pay you more than $2500 just because you bought a degree? Pay in pte sector is determine by demand & supply of each job, not by the fact you got a degree.

The question you should be asking is what kind of job can you take up with that UOL degree? Shortlist a few careers you are interested, then ask for the market pay for those jobs you selected.

Unregistered 24-08-2012 01:33 PM

advice
 
Hi all,

I am a final year UOL Econs & Finance student ( on track to a first class honors ,or at least a 2nd upper). I am converting to PT studies due to financial constraints.

I was thinking of taking up a contractual job for about (1yr) in banks doing ops/admin. Will the experience in bank admin help me in searching for a better job / higher starting pay say 2.8ish in the banking industry when i graduate?

I've been applying for many banking ops / jr position in risk management dept but none of them replied me though i've gotten a few offers for doing admin in banks. As of now, i hold a diploma and no banking experience at all.

Should i just take up the admin position in banks for the time being?

Unregistered 24-08-2012 04:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 27728)
Hi all,

I am a final year UOL Econs & Finance student ( on track to a first class honors ,or at least a 2nd upper). I am converting to PT studies due to financial constraints.

I was thinking of taking up a contractual job for about (1yr) in banks doing ops/admin. Will the experience in bank admin help me in searching for a better job / higher starting pay say 2.8ish in the banking industry when i graduate?

I've been applying for many banking ops / jr position in risk management dept but none of them replied me though i've gotten a few offers for doing admin in banks. As of now, i hold a diploma and no banking experience at all.

Should i just take up the admin position in banks for the time being?

What is the career you want? If it is for the hope that somehow you will get "real" banking jobs, then I say forget it, UOL pt degree is no hope even for local banks.

Stories about some small guy that make it big without a first class degree by entering through some admin BO function are largely urban legend. Every year there are scores of dissappointed fc honors from NUS/SMU who didn't get into the lucrative jobs, UOL chances are even slimmer.

Fact is UOL pt degree needs a lot of luck to even land a normal corporate finance job in MNC. You should invest ur time & effort down this route which has at least 30% chance success than waste precious time on some <1% success banking fantasy.


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