Anyone work in JPM/GS/Morgan Stanley back office before?

Originally Posted by Unregistered

12 hours for MO is pretty crazy. Correct me if I’m wrong, don’t these graduate programs place them into associate roles after 2 years or so?

Thanks for the spontaneous replies by the way!

Np. They have a "chance" to be promoted to associate in 2.5 years (the local uni intake usually comes in around Jun/July. Performance reviews happen in the second half of the year, and promotions at end of year/start of year). But people who don't get hired through these programs also have a chance to be promoted in 2.5 years as well.

Of course, if you already have 2 years of experience outside, and you join right in the middle of the review cycle, you'll need to do 1 full year so that you will be included in performance review. Then in this case, you will take longer to promote simply by virtue of time, and you having only 1 year to familiarize yourself with the firm systems/tasks.

But if you join as a graduate (maybe just a few months after the university intake), you should not be put at any disadvantage at all, as you'll still be treated as being in the same class.

Originally Posted by Unregistered

Np. They have a "chance" to be promoted to associate in 2.5 years (the local uni intake usually comes in around Jun/July. Performance reviews happen in the second half of the year, and promotions at end of year/start of year). But people who don't get hired through these programs also have a chance to be promoted in 2.5 years as well.

Of course, if you already have 2 years of experience outside, and you join right in the middle of the review cycle, you'll need to do 1 full year so that you will be included in performance review. Then in this case, you will take longer to promote simply by virtue of time, and you having only 1 year to familiarize yourself with the firm systems/tasks.

But if you join as a graduate (maybe just a few months after the university intake), you should not be put at any disadvantage at all, as you'll still be treated as being in the same class.

Did you join as a direct hire? Also interested to find out if your salary trajectory and career progression would be faster/slower if you stayed in one bank for the entirety of the 5 years.

Originally Posted by Unregistered

Did you join as a direct hire? Also interested to find out if your salary trajectory and career progression would be faster/slower if you stayed in one bank for the entirety of the 5 years.

Yup I joined them straight out of school. Tough to say, but if salary was the only factor to consider I would choose to stay in GS as long as possible (simply because I've had the best increases and opportunities there). Of course, selecting a job is never just about money; there will be other things one will consider, like WLB.

Again, this is purely for MO/BO, and based on my personal experience.

[Hardworking]

Originally Posted by Unregistered

Yup I joined them straight out of school. Tough to say, but if salary was the only factor to consider I would choose to stay in GS as long as possible (simply because I've had the best increases and opportunities there). Of course, selecting a job is never just about money; there will be other things one will consider, like WLB.

Again, this is purely for MO/BO, and based on my personal experience.

how much was the increment from analyst to senior analyst? and typical bonus?

Originally Posted by Hardworking

how much was the increment from analyst to senior analyst? and typical bonus?

Hi, a similar question was asked on this thread. You can take a look at my previous response.

[Hardworking]

Originally Posted by Unregistered

Hi, a similar question was asked on this thread. You can take a look at my previous response.

oh! thank you! saw the post on bonus. What about increment year on year? (with promotion and without promotion?) not sure what to expect

Originally Posted by Hardworking

oh! thank you! saw the post on bonus. What about increment year on year? (with promotion and without promotion?) not sure what to expect

Shall not compare promotion vs non-promotion years; some BB banks give a pay bump during promotion years, and give little during non-promotion years. Others have a more normalized pay structure that is more dependent on performance.

Increments are generally higher in both absolute and % level at the junior levels. During my first full review, I got an increment of ~25% as I was one of the few top performers. Sounds a lot, but when your base was 4k+ per month as a grad, it's actually not much. My career average is about 14% year on year (after taking into account promotions, good/bad years for the industry etc). Fortunate, as I think it's higher than most of my peers. Most of my peers with similar YOE are tracking at about 8-10% annual growth.

Of course, it's not as crazy as one would expect of an FO role, and you most certainly won't be rich. But I'd still think it would give you a comfortable life in the future.

Originally Posted by Hardworking

oh! thank you! saw the post on bonus. What about increment year on year? (with promotion and without promotion?) not sure what to expect

I shall not compare promotion vs non-promotion years; some BB banks give a pay bump during promotion years, and give little during non-promotion years. Others have a more normalized pay structure that is more dependent on performance.

Increments are generally higher in both absolute and % level at the junior levels. During my first full review, I got an increment of ~25% as I was one of the few top performers. Sounds a lot, but when your base was 4k+ per month as a grad, it's actually not much. My career average is about 14% year on year (after taking into account promotions, good/bad years for the industry etc). Fortunate, as I think it's higher than most of my peers. Most of my peers with similar YOE are tracking at about 8-10% annual growth.

Of course, it's not as crazy as one would being in an FO role, and you most certainly won't be rich. But I'd still think it would give you a comfortable life.

Originally Posted by Unregistered

I shall not compare promotion vs non-promotion years; some BB banks give a pay bump during promotion years, and give little during non-promotion years. Others have a more normalized pay structure that is more dependent on performance.

Increments are generally higher in both absolute and % level at the junior levels. During my first full review, I got an increment of ~25% as I was one of the few top performers. Sounds a lot, but when your base was 4k+ per month as a grad, it's actually not much. My career average is about 14% year on year (after taking into account promotions, good/bad years for the industry etc). Fortunate, as I think it's higher than most of my peers. Most of my peers with similar YOE are tracking at about 8-10% annual growth.

Of course, it's not as crazy as one would being in an FO role, and you most certainly won't be rich. But I'd still think it would give you a comfortable life.

Comfortable life sufficient to afford condo and car? Also would like to know what constitutes a good performer haha

Originally Posted by Unregistered

Comfortable life sufficient to afford condo and car? Also would like to know what constitutes a good performer haha

The prices for condos/cars can range from affordable to crazy rich asian. With 5-6 YOE, I could use all my liquid assets + CPF to afford the downpayment on a 1.5m condo by myself if I want, but is it prudent? Probably not. I think you need to define what you want in life, and do the calculation for how much you need.

I can give you the numbers, and you can decide whether it's enough for you. Starting salaries for BB MO/BO are generally between 4k-5k. Apply an annual growth rate to this number (You can use the numbers I shared, or you can apply your own), and decide when you would want to buy a house/car.

I think "good performer" can mean many things, depending on your level/role. Some of the questions bosses may ask are: Are you contributing to huge projects? Are you increasing efficiency such that the team can reduce its headcount budget? Are you delivering value to the firm (like cost savings) that goes beyond what they are paying you? Can you communicate with senior management? Can you manage the juniors under you?