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Unregistered 25-08-2021 10:21 PM

Can an above average engineer earn above 12k after spending 10 years in DSTA?

Unregistered 25-08-2021 10:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 181212)
Can an above average engineer earn above 12k after spending 10 years in DSTA?

Not as basic salary, annual divide by 12 probably can

Unregistered 31-08-2021 07:27 PM

for dsta, understand that a g50 clearance is required but i see contradicting steps based on the previous posts.

Some get offer before g50 submission.
Some get g50 submission only and have to wait for clearance.

for the latter, did anyone have experience how long did you wait before an offer or maybe a rejection came?

CorgiHamster 31-08-2021 10:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 178818)
yeah engineer turnover is low. But given the pay commanded by dsta engineers, i think also difficult for most to let go of the golden handcuffs, so can tahan a bit

hahaha, procurement on the other hand, can only say they really deserve a lot better for what they have to deal with.

so non procurement roles is not so bad in DSTA?

Unregistered 31-08-2021 10:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CorgiHamster (Post 181748)
so non procurement roles is not so bad in DSTA?

it is not so black and white like engineer good, procurement bad. engineering population is huge, got some variance in experience across programme centres (and even within, all depends on superior). and also depends on whether you can handle the red tape and bureaucracy. if you can, might be good for you. if you can't, likely you will find it very miserable. like they say, in the public service, people either quit early on or stay forever, there's no in between.

plus, don't forget DSTA serves SAF. and I doubt I need to say more about what SAF culture is like.

the only thing that you can say for certain is the salary for engineers is very good, at least for the starting salary.

Unregistered 31-08-2021 11:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 181751)
it is not so black and white like engineer good, procurement bad. engineering population is huge, got some variance in experience across programme centres (and even within, all depends on superior). and also depends on whether you can handle the red tape and bureaucracy. if you can, might be good for you. if you can't, likely you will find it very miserable. like they say, in the public service, people either quit early on or stay forever, there's no in between.

plus, don't forget DSTA serves SAF. and I doubt I need to say more about what SAF culture is like.

the only thing that you can say for certain is the salary for engineers is very good, at least for the starting salary.

What do you think about joining for the starting salary, pick up some tech experience, leave after 2 years? how much would my salary be by then assuming average performance?

Unregistered 31-08-2021 11:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 181752)
What do you think about joining for the starting salary, pick up some tech experience, leave after 2 years? how much would my salary be by then assuming average performance?

leave for other public agency? might work out.

leave for private sector? no one is going to match your salary :)

unless you have some exceptional transferable skillset, likely any engineer who leaves will need to take a pay cut.

Unregistered 01-09-2021 12:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 181759)
leave for other public agency? might work out.

leave for private sector? no one is going to match your salary :)

unless you have some exceptional transferable skillset, likely any engineer who leaves will need to take a pay cut.

This is how dsta traps young engineers, high starting salary but 3-5 years down the road their peers outside start to overtake them and by then they would have no transferable skills to get out. If get out would need to take paycut and start from zero.

Unregistered 01-09-2021 09:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 181761)
This is how dsta traps young engineers, high starting salary but 3-5 years down the road their peers outside start to overtake them and by then they would have no transferable skills to get out. If get out would need to take paycut and start from zero.

Yup, the so called golden handcuffs. It is a big reason why engineer turnover is quite low as opposed to procurement (can't expect people to stay when you pay peanuts but thats of topic) It is still not the worst job with the current state of the job market, but if you are thinking about doing a short stint and leaving that is really not the best idea unless you have a solid plan for the next 5-10 years for your career trajectory.

Unregistered 01-09-2021 11:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 180282)
I only got 5% increment for B grade, but including salary review around 10% annual increment

What do you mean by salary review?
Is it Every year have a salary review in addition to annual increment?

Unregistered 01-09-2021 01:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 181721)
for dsta, understand that a g50 clearance is required but i see contradicting steps based on the previous posts.

Some get offer before g50 submission.
Some get g50 submission only and have to wait for clearance.

for the latter, did anyone have experience how long did you wait before an offer or maybe a rejection came?

Bump. Anyone ?

Unregistered 01-09-2021 02:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 181806)
Bump. Anyone ?

unfortunately can't say much about your questions because it will vary from individual to individual and also the circumstances and specific role. if they really want you, it can be as quick as 1 day, otherwise it can also take ages.

best is to assume if no notice after 2-3 weeks, can follow up if you wish or assume you are rejected.

Unregistered 01-09-2021 03:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 181211)
Procurement is a toxic place to work in because of the high workload and uncooperative people (management, SAF, DSTA engineers).

Workload is extremely high. It is not equally distributed among teams but workload is high across all teams. OT is expected, just a matter of how much. Eventually you will realize that there is no way to re-prioritize because everything is urgent. When the user complains, you are required to come up with timeline to explain why it is not your fault. But end up still your fault and you are required to expedite as if it was your fault. Other projects will be affected and you are required to do the explanation all over again.

SAF is the biggest culprit for the additional workload. Most of them have absolutely no idea what the heck they are suppose to do and procurement is expected to 'help' (hidden meaning: do for them) them even if it is clearly not your responsibility.

Knowledge - You get some procurement knowledge but hardly get to apply them or think through. The workload is too high and the priority is to complete the procurement on the path least resistance. You do get a lot of government procurement knowledge which is useful when jumping to other public agencies. It's the center of excellence because of the amount of work on your plate that grows so fast that you get expose to a lot of procurement issues in a short time.

Salary - The salary is about the same as other public agencies and private sector. There are some differences but it is still a salary that other public agencies and private sector can afford to pay easily.

No harm joining if you can't find a job but keep a lookout for better jobs. You don't want to be in a situation when you feel burnout and there's no backup jobs.

agree with most of everything that is said here. you really are forced to take the blame and responsibility for SAF users and DSTA engineers but you have no authority to make them do their part. and just to add on about the salary part, procurement salary can be easily matched or sometimes even higher elsewhere even in private sector, so you can roughly tell the remuneration is nothing to shout about.

Unregistered 02-09-2021 09:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 181211)
Procurement is a toxic place to work in because of the high workload and uncooperative people (management, SAF, DSTA engineers).

Workload is extremely high. It is not equally distributed among teams but workload is high across all teams. OT is expected, just a matter of how much. Eventually you will realize that there is no way to re-prioritize because everything is urgent. When the user complains, you are required to come up with timeline to explain why it is not your fault. But end up still your fault and you are required to expedite as if it was your fault. Other projects will be affected and you are required to do the explanation all over again.

SAF is the biggest culprit for the additional workload. Most of them have absolutely no idea what the heck they are suppose to do and procurement is expected to 'help' (hidden meaning: do for them) them even if it is clearly not your responsibility.

Knowledge - You get some procurement knowledge but hardly get to apply them or think through. The workload is too high and the priority is to complete the procurement on the path least resistance. You do get a lot of government procurement knowledge which is useful when jumping to other public agencies. It's the center of excellence because of the amount of work on your plate that grows so fast that you get expose to a lot of procurement issues in a short time.

Salary - The salary is about the same as other public agencies and private sector. There are some differences but it is still a salary that other public agencies and private sector can afford to pay easily.

No harm joining if you can't find a job but keep a lookout for better jobs. You don't want to be in a situation when you feel burnout and there's no backup jobs.

absolutely true. to add on about the salary part, its also not unheard for people to be paid a lot better once they jump ship elsewhere. so ya, it's really very awful work conditions for very average pay and very poor progression here as procurement.

Unregistered 15-09-2021 03:46 PM

Got provisional offer from DSTA, very confused
 
I am a CS student in NUS, y4 now, and applied for a software engineering role in the enterprise IT deparment.

I passed the first round, then yesterday had 2nd round of interview. I passed the interview and just got a provisional offer, base pay 3.9k but 4-4.6k after I graduate. The pay will be scaled according to my degree classification.

When I was talking to the recruiter, he mentioned that DSTA works by 16 months meaning I will get 12 months pay + 4 extra months pay? I don't understand what this all means and I'm so confused.

I am not sure if I should accept this offer or not, they are giving me a 7 day window to accept/reject this offer and I'm not sure if this offer is good.

Anyone here working at DSTA as a software engineer can advise on the work culture and if this is a good offer? Please help :(

Unregistered 16-09-2021 02:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 181806)
Bump. Anyone ?

i waited 1-2 months for them to do the checks etc

Unregistered 16-09-2021 05:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 183270)
i waited 1-2 months for them to do the checks etc

so after the check were you offered the package straight away?

Unregistered 16-09-2021 06:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 183289)
so after the check were you offered the package straight away?

Dunno how it usually works. 1st round interview then ask me submit. Then go for second round interview while checking . Then after that then they call me to offer sth

Unregistered 16-09-2021 07:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 183295)
Dunno how it usually works. 1st round interview then ask me submit. Then go for second round interview while checking . Then after that then they call me to offer sth

oh i see, thanks ! so there still might be a 2nd interview and its not confirmed after request for g50 submission.

Unregistered 16-09-2021 10:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 183300)
oh i see, thanks ! so there still might be a 2nd interview and its not confirmed after request for g50 submission.

I'm not sure how it works for u. Usually the 1st round interviewer will inform u if there's a 2nd round interview for any company generally speaking. Just wait ba it takes some time to clear right

Unregistered 16-09-2021 10:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 183312)
I'm not sure how it works for u. Usually the 1st round interviewer will inform u if there's a 2nd round interview for any company generally speaking. Just wait ba it takes some time to clear right

yeah. thanks man ! yeah just hoping for the best.

Unregistered 18-09-2021 09:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 183185)
I am a CS student in NUS, y4 now, and applied for a software engineering role in the enterprise IT deparment.

I passed the first round, then yesterday had 2nd round of interview. I passed the interview and just got a provisional offer, base pay 3.9k but 4-4.6k after I graduate. The pay will be scaled according to my degree classification.

When I was talking to the recruiter, he mentioned that DSTA works by 16 months meaning I will get 12 months pay + 4 extra months pay? I don't understand what this all means and I'm so confused.

I am not sure if I should accept this offer or not, they are giving me a 7 day window to accept/reject this offer and I'm not sure if this offer is good.

Anyone here working at DSTA as a software engineer can advise on the work culture and if this is a good offer? Please help :(

CS majors should always look for private sector jobs first, only join gov if you have no other choice

Unregistered 18-09-2021 07:41 PM

As a cs grad, i would recommend you consider the other departments like infomation pc, digital hub and pc8. You will learn alot more there and apply your skills and knowledge better. Culture depends alot on your bosses but people are generally friendly and nice. If you hate your boss, you can easily flag to change your team or dept 24/7.

12 months base + 13th month + civil/public service bonus + perf bonus. why dont you apply for the internship to learn more?

Unregistered 28-09-2021 04:36 PM

Same
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 183185)
I am a CS student in NUS, y4 now, and applied for a software engineering role in the enterprise IT deparment.

I passed the first round, then yesterday had 2nd round of interview. I passed the interview and just got a provisional offer, base pay 3.9k but 4-4.6k after I graduate. The pay will be scaled according to my degree classification.

When I was talking to the recruiter, he mentioned that DSTA works by 16 months meaning I will get 12 months pay + 4 extra months pay? I don't understand what this all means and I'm so confused.

I am not sure if I should accept this offer or not, they are giving me a 7 day window to accept/reject this offer and I'm not sure if this offer is good.

Anyone here working at DSTA as a software engineer can advise on the work culture and if this is a good offer? Please help :(

I got the same offer sia.. NTU CS Yr 4, for C3D programme centre.. any advise??

Unregistered 29-09-2021 06:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 184509)
I got the same offer sia.. NTU CS Yr 4, for C3D programme centre.. any advise??

Hi went to PC11 instead.

_bluehavens 03-10-2021 12:56 AM

Anyone knows whether it's worthwhile to join DSTA?

I heard its a lot of paper work and get really office-work-like and boring. But at the same time I think should be able to travel to many nice countries (US, France) to look at their tech and do business trips?

So which one is it??

Unregistered 03-10-2021 11:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by _bluehavens (Post 185060)
Anyone knows whether it's worthwhile to join DSTA?

I heard its a lot of paper work and get really office-work-like and boring. But at the same time I think should be able to travel to many nice countries (US, France) to look at their tech and do business trips?

So which one is it??

Such business trips are few and far between, should not be a consideration for you to join

Unregistered 13-10-2021 05:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 184509)
I got the same offer sia.. NTU CS Yr 4, for C3D programme centre.. any advise??

I just joined C3D this year, starting pay 4.3k and bumped to 5k upon getting degree. So far the work is okay la, minimal office politics but also depends on your team. If you want to chiong and have the aptitude I would suggest looking at private companies like shopee / lazada.

Another thing that I've heard (not verified) is that govtech pays slightly better than DSTA due to the way they structure their salary grades. If you come to DSTA as a software engineer, your title is still "Engineer" and you will be paid the same salary grade as all the other engineers. Whereas in govtech, since all their engineers are doing IT, their salary grade has a higher base pay. Again, this is not verified.

Unregistered 14-10-2021 11:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 186124)
I just joined C3D this year, starting pay 4.3k and bumped to 5k upon getting degree. So far the work is okay la, minimal office politics but also depends on your team. If you want to chiong and have the aptitude I would suggest looking at private companies like shopee / lazada.

Another thing that I've heard (not verified) is that govtech pays slightly better than DSTA due to the way they structure their salary grades. If you come to DSTA as a software engineer, your title is still "Engineer" and you will be paid the same salary grade as all the other engineers. Whereas in govtech, since all their engineers are doing IT, their salary grade has a higher base pay. Again, this is not verified.

from the way u ate saying, looks like ur gonna jump after 2 years

Unregistered 15-10-2021 01:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 184509)
I got the same offer sia.. NTU CS Yr 4, for C3D programme centre.. any advise??

that's wierd, did they lower the pay grade for the next FY?

Unregistered 15-10-2021 03:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 186470)
that's wierd, did they lower the pay grade for the next FY?

what was the previous pay like?

Unregistered 15-10-2021 03:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 186470)
that's wierd, did they lower the pay grade for the next FY?

or is it cause im female

Unregistered 20-10-2021 03:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 186492)
or is it cause im female

oh yeah it's one of those bullshit things. The girls get lesser pay citing that the guys have "more experience" due to NS. It's a... real issue in the government sector...

Unregistered 21-10-2021 07:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 187192)
oh yeah it's one of those bullshit things. The girls get lesser pay citing that the guys have "more experience" due to NS. It's a... real issue in the government sector...

I would rather get that few hundred dollars less pay and not have to serve NS

Unregistered 08-11-2021 05:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 187263)
I would rather get that few hundred dollars less pay and not have to serve NS

nah, you wont say that when you have calculated that extra money (~400-500) accumulated per year, including bonuses. the extra money that guy are getting affects them a long way, maybe forever if they stay in PS/CS. that's the very advantage you get for 2 years NS. Females almost never can go ahead of you in terms of money unless she is a scholar..coming from a female myself and have been in PS/CS for years.

Unregistered 08-11-2021 05:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 189426)
nah, you wont say that when you have calculated that extra money (~400-500) accumulated per year, including bonuses. the extra money that guy are getting affects them a long way, maybe forever if they stay in PS/CS. that's the very advantage you get for 2 years NS. Females almost never can go ahead of you in terms of money unless she is a scholar..coming from a female myself and have been in PS/CS for years.

my ~400-500 is per month extra, then after that, you calculate at a 15-16 months package annually, you will see how much more. When you get promoted, or the annual increment is calculated in percentage, it just keeps piling up YoY.

Unregistered 08-11-2021 07:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 189426)
nah, you wont say that when you have calculated that extra money (~400-500) accumulated per year, including bonuses. the extra money that guy are getting affects them a long way, maybe forever if they stay in PS/CS. that's the very advantage you get for 2 years NS. Females almost never can go ahead of you in terms of money unless she is a scholar..coming from a female myself and have been in PS/CS for years.

Only matters if you are staying in civil service for > 10 years. For the typical hire, they're only there for 3 to 4 years before moving on to private sector.

Unregistered 08-11-2021 07:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 189431)
Only matters if you are staying in civil service for > 10 years. For the typical hire, they're only there for 3 to 4 years before moving on to private sector.

But the higher starting pay already put you on the upper edge when you wan to ask for more at private, or unless you are willing to get lesser to go private, i am quite sure if private cannot match, no one will jump.

Unregistered 08-11-2021 09:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 189426)
nah, you wont say that when you have calculated that extra money (~400-500) accumulated per year, including bonuses. the extra money that guy are getting affects them a long way, maybe forever if they stay in PS/CS. that's the very advantage you get for 2 years NS. Females almost never can go ahead of you in terms of money unless she is a scholar..coming from a female myself and have been in PS/CS for years.

After reading a few of these posts, I think you haven't consider the fact that females would start work 2 years earlier, i.e. a female at age 25 would earn 2 years of salary more than a guy at age 25. Not to forget from there would be possibly increment when you work from age 23 to age 25.

Of course, I haven't do any intense calculations, so I dare not say in the end long run which gender would earn more/less etc, but hopefully you can understand the above point.

Unregistered 09-11-2021 01:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered (Post 189428)
my ~400-500 is per month extra, then after that, you calculate at a 15-16 months package annually, you will see how much more. When you get promoted, or the annual increment is calculated in percentage, it just keeps piling up YoY.

Did u forget that females start work earlier by 2 years? I am sure the 2 years of extra salary compounded over the next 40 years when invested. Also females will still get annual increments and likely to have higher pay than the guy who enter workfare at 25.

Female at 23 years old 3600. Gets 250 annually = $4100 at age 25 (and 2 years of savings head start)
VS
Male who enters workforce at 25 with NS factor = 3600 + 300 (NS) = $3900

Now tell me who is at the losing end?


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