Salary.sg Forums  

Go Back   Salary.sg Forums > The Salary.sg Discussion Forums: > Investments and Net Worth

Investments and Net Worth Talk all about money making exploits, shares, property, building net worth and retirement matters


Property Prices Must Plunge (graph included)

Reply
 
Thread Tools
  #1 (permalink)  
Old 21-03-2008, 10:45 PM
Salary.sg
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Property Prices Must Plunge (graph included)

The STI stock market index has plunged about 20% from its peak, but the URA property index still seems to move up exponentially.

How can this be?

Let's study the STI graph superimposed over the URA property index graph. Both graphs are scaled such that their time axes coincide, and their Asian financial crisis bottoms & dotcom peaks are at the same levels. STI is indicated by the dark blue line, while the pink line with blue crosses is for the URA index for condominiums (the other lines are for detached, semi-detached, terrace and apartments):



You should be able to see from the 2 graphs that the property bottom in end 1998 lagged the stocks bottom by about a quarter (i.e. 3 months). Similarly, the property peak in mid 2000 also lagged the stocks peak by about 1 to 2 quarters.

Now, fast forward to end 2007. The stock market has clearly tanked, amidst high inflation and comparatively stagnant salaries. But property is apparently still moving up, up and up! This can't continue.

I hereby predict that property prices will plunge within the next 3 to 6 months. By at least 20%.

Want more evidence? In the last month (February), property developers were so spooked by the worsening economy that they launched only 343 units in the whole country, out of which only a miserable 170 got sold (excluding ECs). Oh yeah, maybe it's the Chinese New Year.

References: URA news release and STI data in Yahoo! Finance.

http://www.salary.sg/2008/property-p...raph-included/
Reply With Quote
  #2 (permalink)  
Old 22-03-2008, 12:34 AM
no buyers---
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default 1133

Prices are still high because sellers are still asking for sky high prices, but buyers are unwilling to fall for the trap, with some buyers making offers that are laughed at by the proud sellers.
Hence the low number of transactions.
There may be fire sale deals when sub-sales speculators can't get bank loans at TOP, or people who pool money to speculate on property start to have disagreements, or they start losing jobs and can't afford to hold any longer.
Then I'll jump in.
Reply With Quote
  #3 (permalink)  
Old 22-03-2008, 09:56 AM
buyer---
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default 1137

Many are still holding up with expectations that property prices will appreciate come the launch of the Integrated Resorts. The dipping economy should be an indication for the speculative sellers (HDB Dwellers and Pvt Owners) that things will not be as rosy as what they think. Prices are already way off fundamentals. Those that do not learn from market forces will only have to learn through getting their fingers burnt. I'll wait till then to buy. Stocking cash now is the best option (inflations the killer though).
Reply With Quote
  #4 (permalink)  
Old 22-03-2008, 12:52 PM
advertisements---
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default 1139

Just look at the classified ads today (Saturday) - so many sub sale sellers but still so wishful asking prices.
I just checked the URA list of caveats - since 2008, there have not been many transactions. Sub sales are like only a handful.
The speculators will get burnt!
Agents will waste hundreds of dollars on useless advertisements.
Maybe I'm gonna call some of them and make some offers - 30% off their asking price. Let them laugh at me and see who's laughing in the end.
Reply With Quote
  #5 (permalink)  
Old 22-03-2008, 05:50 PM
larger graphics---
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default 1141

Possible to post larger graphics? The current one is too small to make out the details such as dates. Great article. Thank you.
Reply With Quote
  #6 (permalink)  
Old 22-03-2008, 06:46 PM
admin---
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default 1142

Hi there, I've uploaded a larger image of the graphs here:
http://www.salary.sg/historical-property-index-against-STI-2008-large.gif
Reply With Quote
  #7 (permalink)  
Old 23-03-2008, 12:53 AM
Kevin---
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default 1143

I think you are overfitting the curves too closely from 99 to 03 and using the URA price index and STI at different scales (e.g., STI from 1000 to 4000, but URA PI only from 100 to 180). While we can see that both moves in the same direction, it is very hard to extrapolate on the two variables, percentage of decline and the timing of it.

If we say that STI is around 1000 in mid 98 and it went up to 3800ish (?) at its peak, it is an increase of 280% and assuming 180 is the peak for the URA Price Index, it is an increase of 80%. Therefore, using basic proportions, a 25%ish drop in shares price will now only mean less than 8% drop in property prices.
Reply With Quote
  #8 (permalink)  
Old 23-03-2008, 02:29 AM
buyer---
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default 1144

Regardless of how its being scaling, the market should move in tandem. Should the STI continue to head southwards, speculators will need to cash out unless they are prepared to wait it out. Once rental yields and market value dips, then they are really stuck with a long term liability (good luck to those those that bought 99 year old 1000psf and above high end properties).
Reply With Quote
  #9 (permalink)  
Old 24-03-2008, 04:03 PM
neutral---
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default 1153

If a chart like that can predict property up & down, then very easy to get rich & make money.
There is lot of different between 2000 & now.
Population already big difference, our target now is 6M & yearly 80000 of immigrants & PR, plus another 80k of foreign talents, do we have this in yr 2000?
We are undergoing transformation now, what is 2000?
Inflation is different too, loan rate, rental yield.....
Demand & supply is totally unbalanced in 2000, there is excess of 18k of HDB at that time. Some units still keep until now. This is a big lesson HDB must learn, never over-build, waste of taxpayer money, we will challenge them if they make same mistake again.


Singapore Jobs Search Engine | Salary.sg
Search for Your Ideal Job at Our Jobs Search Engine
Reply With Quote
  #10 (permalink)  
Old 24-03-2008, 07:30 PM
lose money---
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default 1155

i'd say the chart tells us it's very easy to lose money!
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

« Previous Thread | Next Thread »
Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Property Prices Have Crashed (see graph) Salary.sg Investments and Net Worth 126 04-01-2012 01:07 AM
Check property prices Salary.sg Investments and Net Worth 2 01-07-2009 05:41 PM
Property Must Crash (see graph) Salary.sg Investments and Net Worth 26 04-02-2009 10:07 AM
Property Transactions Crashed (see graph), Agents Go Hungry Salary.sg Investments and Net Worth 4 28-12-2008 05:36 PM
Property Prices Continue To Rise Salary.sg Investments and Net Worth 5 06-04-2008 03:20 AM

» 30 Recent Threads
Go to first new post Constituency Manager (People... ( 1 2 3... Last Page)
56 Replies, 5,534 Views
Getting MBA worth?
2 Replies, 97 Views
Advice needed!! SPF Senior police... ( 1 2 3)
23 Replies, 10,111 Views
Mnc jobs - a must in life ?? ( 1 2 3)
21 Replies, 2,259 Views
Compare civil service salary ( 1 2 3... Last Page)
1,396 Replies, 436,963 Views
Expected salary of System Analyst
1 Replies, 86 Views
Banking for HNWI / Private Banks
0 Replies, 64 Views
I versus Foreign Talent ( 1 2 3... Last Page)
32 Replies, 3,601 Views
What do you spend your salary on ? ( 1 2)
15 Replies, 1,687 Views
how much % jump do you ask for?
6 Replies, 519 Views
Salary Increment Rate ( 1 2)
12 Replies, 1,907 Views
How much are you earning per annum? ( 1 2 3... Last Page)
1,249 Replies, 396,011 Views
Starting pay for a CPA (USA) in... ( 1 2)
17 Replies, 4,440 Views
Which degree? Economics or...
2 Replies, 282 Views
Aeronautical Engineering Diploma
2 Replies, 139 Views
People in the financial industry,... ( 1 2 3)
23 Replies, 2,042 Views
Worst type of engineer ( 1 2 3... Last Page)
42 Replies, 3,737 Views
How is life as a doctor in... ( 1 2 3... Last Page)
51 Replies, 29,994 Views
Future of IT industry
9 Replies, 945 Views
Really that bad for engineers? ( 1 2 3... Last Page)
490 Replies, 108,907 Views
I want to quit - R&D Engineer
1 Replies, 328 Views
Salary range for project manager... ( 1 2 3... Last Page)
40 Replies, 13,988 Views
Problem, please advise
1 Replies, 192 Views
SMU Law (JD) Job prospects
6 Replies, 2,810 Views
Lawyer Salary ( 1 2 3... Last Page)
70 Replies, 36,547 Views
SIM-UOL fresh grad starting pay ( 1 2 3... Last Page)
124 Replies, 27,488 Views
Thinking of doing an IT... ( 1 2 3)
26 Replies, 4,598 Views
How much savings do you have? ( 1 2 3... Last Page)
153 Replies, 30,827 Views
Allied Educator (Teaching &...
4 Replies, 265 Views
Thinking of doing an Digital Media... ( 1 2 3)
26 Replies, 4,667 Views
Powered by vBadvanced CMPS v3.2.2

All times are GMT +8. The time now is 01:36 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.5
Copyright ©2000 - 2012, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 3.3.2